Kitchen/Hedge Witchcraft vs. Wicca

[fafonen]

I'm sorry if this seems really ignorant, but I've just recently become interested in learning more about kitchen/hedge witchcraft and I'm not really clear on the differences between Wiccans and Hedge Witches.

I'm especially interested in differences in terms of rites and rituals and magic. Like, for example, do hedge witches cast a circle, use a pentacle and the elements the way that modern Wiccans do? I was wondering if maybe Hedge witches have different practices than Wiccans in that regard as well as the ways in which Hedge witches would approach divinity versus the way Wiccans would approach divinity and how they differ or are similar in how they honor divinity.

For me, personally, I'm not terribly interested in magic but I am very interested in folklore and herbalism and kitchen and hedge witchcraft seemed to fit the bill from what I had read (which is very little, so far) and generally would just like some solid information from those with more experience than myself.

[ap Dafydd]

Most of us would admit to having some Wiccan influence!

I've never been a Wiccan but as an outsider some of the key differences would seem to be

- most cunning folk are solitary rather than working in groups
- lineage is not that important
- having the "right" tools and equipment is less important, we are more likely to use what comes to hand
- much of what we do comes from the folklore tradition rather than the Gardnerian
- we tend to keep our kit on when we're working!

gwyn eich byd

Ffred

[kitsch]

^^I would agree. Very well said. :)

I don't tend to cast a circle myself. I look at my home as being "good enough" as is without having to additionally sanctify it.

My personal approach to witchcraft is as I imagine witches/wise folk used to practice. I'd rather use a beeswax candle than a coloured paraffin one. I use a plain kitchen knife instead of an athame. A specific pot instead of a cauldron (though I do have a pretty cauldron for outdoor work).

Basically, I try to keep things simple. I don't always follow the same rituals; I improvise a lot using what I have on hand. My "Book of Shadows" is actually a recipe box stuffed with index cards and miscellaneous notes. I enjoy the spontenaity of being able to grab what I need, throw it in a pot, and have magic come out.

[Pagan Mantis]

I think all of these responses pretty much nail it! In my opinion, it seems that the term "Wicca" is a more recent development in the religious aspect. Along the lines of casting a circle, the choice is up to the individual. However, the magic you practice within your home (especially in the case of the Kitchen Witch) I feel that the circle casting is actually becomming more and more the boundaries of your walls, or if you look at it from a protection standpoint, the sphere enclosing your home, kitchen, etc. Casting a circle is basically asking the Elementals, Deities and other wanted guests to attend your spellworking for some added protection from negativity.

Along the lines of tools, as a Greenie I feel that what is at hand is what is used. Our Mother supplies for us what we need, and it's actually quite easy to find objects in nature to be used as ritual tools.

[Cindlady2]

I pretty much agree with the above. Most of us are quite 'free' in our work and are often been taught/influenced/inspired by nature more than anything. I think most of us don't even have specific deities we call upon.

[Duwayitheru]

Unlike most Wiccans, I do not worship the Goddess and God. In fact, for the most part my magic has been without Deity - though lately Brighid has been coming around more.

I do not cast circles. Nor do I use the pentacle at all (well, cept in my tarot cards, heh). Nothing against the symbol or anything, just not one that comes up for me a lot. I work with the elements, but I am not sure if it is the same way a Wiccan does..

Like I said earlier, Deity has not played much of a role in my witchcraft. I don't use witchcraft to connect with Deity. I would think that is a main difference for me.. Wicca is a religion, where as for me witchcraft is not. That would be the main difference in how I practice than how a Wiccan does.

My practice is pretty simplistic. Folklore, herbal healing and magic, elemental magic, being at one with the cycle of nature. There's not a lot of formal ritual or anything like that. My magical focus is on my home and family.

There are some things which could be the same. I celebrate the wheel of the year.. though I would guess differently than most Wiccans. Follow moon cycle.. etc. There are certianly some things in common.

(Also, this is just my particular spin on it all, others may practice differently. :) )

[fafonen]

Thanks to everyone who's posted so far! You've been very helpful.

Part of why I was wondering about how Hedge witches relate to divinity is that I consider myself more a pantheist than anything else and don't really worship specific deities. In addition, I've never been Wiccan just because it's never really appealed to me so I was wondering how similar or different the two practices are. I'm glad to here that most Hedge witches are very simplistic and eclectic (using whatever's on hand).

[Nitefalle]

Hm...I agree for the most part with what people have said so far, but wanted to add a few things.

Wicca (specifically, how it was envisioned by Gardner) borrows from many different paths, many of the Eastern in origin. His path had very set tenets (the Wiccan Rede, belief in Lord and Lady, having both said deities present at every ritual, etc.) and for the most part, they seemed soft polytheists (the softest, in fact, lol). From what I understand, they belive in a Lord and Lady because they see this gender duality as reflected in nature & the universe at large. They also are ceremonial in nature, and honor the full moons (Esbats), as well as the eight Pagan festivals of the year (Sabbats). Rather than looking to the originators of these festivals, Wicca created its own mythos for the Wheal of the Year, centering around the Lord and Lady.

I'm sure everyone knows this already, but I just wanted to set up a comparison/contrast for easier reference and less run-on sentences.

Now, some people say the terms Hedgewitch and Traditional Witch as though they are interchangeable. Some see them as very different things. What most people have described here, I would put in the category of Traditional Witch (and by "Traditional", I mean native to the UK and Ireland, though they usually seem to identify with the Brits), except that none of us learned it from someone else of the Tradition, at least not that I know of. Now, even though it's called a Tradition with a capital "T", that doesn't mean that everyone does it the same way. Some cast circles, some cast circles "widdershins", some don't cast them at all. Some use deity, some are polytheists, some see it as separate from religion. There is no moral or ethical guidance to look to, no Rede to follow, no judgements of "light vs. dark". There is definitely room for interpretation, personal morals/ethics and personal gnosis. However, to say "eclectic"...I don't know about that. In Paganism, Eclectic seems to imply taking from different cultures and paths because it works for you, and Traditional Witchery and Hedgecraft don't do that. They don't worship Shiva or Amaterasu or use Vedic or Buddhist practices. They use methods that are indigenous to their locale. Very much the medieval old village wise woman type of image.

That's not even to count the people that view Hedgecraft as more of a "shamanic" path (I use that term loosely). Many see Hedgecraft as a path in which psychotropic drugs or plants are used to instigate out of body experiences, during which Hedgewitches can help others or visit the Otherworld for their own purposes. Again, one is left to keep ones own morals and ethics, there is no guide or rule.

Kitchen witches are a much more modern invention. Kitchen witches use whatever is on hand, no special ritual tools or robes or whatnot, and can be as eclectic as they like, practicing however they like. This sort of falls in line with the Cottage witch phenomenon that has come about recently - their practice centers around the hearth and home, their families.

Wow, still a little long-winded....but I just wanted to clarify a little bit. Hope this helps.

[skilly-nilly]

Now, some people say the terms Hedgewitch and Traditional Witch as though they are interchangeable. Some see them as very different things. What most people have described here, I would put in the category of Traditional Witch (and by "Traditional", I mean native to the UK and Ireland, though they usually seem to identify with the Brits), except that none of us learned it from someone else of the Tradition, at least not that I know of. Now, even though it's called a Tradition with a capital "T", that doesn't mean that everyone does it the same way. Some cast circles, some cast circles "widdershins", some don't cast them at all. Some use deity, some are polytheists, some see it as separate from religion. There is definitely room for interpretation and personal gnosis. However, to say "eclectic"...I don't know about that. In Paganism, Eclectic seems to imply taking from different cultures and paths because it works for you, and Traditional Witchery and Hedgecraft don't do that. They don't worship Shiva or Amaterasu or use Vedic or Buddhist practices. They use methods that are indigenous to their locale. Very much the medieval old village wise woman type of image.

That's not even to count the people that view Hedgecraft as more of a "shamanic" path (I use that term loosely). Many see Hedgecraft as a path in which psychotropic drugs or plants are used to instigate out of body experiences, during which Hedgewitches can help others or visit the Otherworld for their own purposes.

Kitchen witches are a much more modern invention. Kitchen witches use whatever is on hand, no special ritual tools or robes or whatnot, and can be as eclectic as they like, practicing however they like. This sort of falls in line with the Cottage witch phenomenon that has come about recently - their practice centers around the hearth and home, their families.

Wow, still a little long-winded....but I just wanted to clarify a little bit. Hope this helps.

That is an excellent post!

I do have a few quibbles, though, even though you are very clear and inclusive in the main part.

You say "by 'Traditional', I mean native to the UK and Ireland" but all of the folk cultures I am aware of have traditional Magic-Workers. There are Strega and Medicine People and Mambos, just to mention cultures I am familiar with, and I know that other cultures have the same role even though I don't know the terms used to identify them. Many of these Magic Workers have absolutely nothing in common with Wicca.

You also say "They use methods that are indigenous to their locale. Very much the medieval old village wise woman type of image." but again, I think you are being a little anthropocentric. Many modern 'Witches' live in post-technological cities and have hardly any knowledge of what their indigenous locales hold, much less how to use them.

IMO, this is too bad, and I think all 'Witches' should try for a little grounding relating to the 'where' of where they are; but I am not the Queen of All Witchery, of course. As well as where you actually are, there is the other where of 'where your folk came from'. I also feel that the culture of your actual ancestry is more accessible than the culture of someone else's ancestry. Although study and practice can create an alternative mind-set it is a significant undertaking (imo) and far more difficult than just being who you really are.

"Kitchen witches are a much more modern invention."??? Kitchens are a more modern invention-----'Hearth Witch', maybe?? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
All poor folk use what is available, and always have.

[Xirian]

Kitchen witches are a much more modern invention. Kitchen witches use whatever is on hand, no special ritual tools or robes or whatnot, and can be as eclectic as they like, practicing however they like. This sort of falls in line with the Cottage witch phenomenon that has come about recently - their practice centers around the hearth and home, their families.
Do you really think that kitchen witchery is a modern invention?

I think if you'd ask some italians or other cultures about this, they might beg to differ. I think that kitchen witchcraft at it's most basic form with absolutely no religion involved has been around for as long as superstitions have been around. I even remember my grandmother using certain items in the kitchen for protection and doing things at certain times to make sure no negative energy was brought into the home and she was Baptist and active in the church. I do not believe she saw herself as a witch and neither did her mother or mother's mother, but I do believe that they were practicing witchcraft. I know there are many italians who practice witchcraft and are Catholics, but do not consider themselves witches, but to others, what they do in their homes would be considered witchcraft.

I know that my grandmother and mother may have done these things without thinking about where they came from, but I know they believed in their actions and their intentions were there. I feel that kitchen witchery has been around for a long time and is not a modern invention, but just has a new name and new practioners.

[Nitefalle]

That is an excellent post!
I do have a few quibbles, though, even though you are very clear and inclusive in the main part.
You say "by 'Traditional', I mean native to the UK and Ireland" but all of the folk cultures I am aware of have traditional Magic-Workers. There are Strega and Medicine People and Mambos, just to mention cultures I am familiar with, and I know that other cultures have the same role even though I don't know the terms used to identify them. Many of these Magic Workers have absolutely nothing in common with Wicca.

Well, first of all, thank you! I did not mean to discount other cultures traditions of magical practice, I just meant (and should have specified) that whenever I have seen the term "Traditional Witchcraft", I have only understood it to mean "Traditional British Witchcraft" and had this explained to me by a practicioner of Traditional British Witchcraft. That is not to say other cultures don't have Traditions, but that is how I understand traditional British witches to actually identify themselves, via that exact term. That is what I meant (and again, should have specified) in my explanation. Sorry for any misunderstandings.

[Xirian]

Nitefalle, would you be so kind as to answer my questions about kitchen witchery being a modern invention.

Please see the post above yours. If I'm on your ignore list, that's perfectly fine, but I am curious to know why you feel that it is a modern invention.

[PoisonIvy]

I think the term "Kitchen Witch" may very well be a "newer" term,but kitchens aren't that modern. There had to be someone cooking in the castle for The King. :drool: And someone was cooking for The Pharoh. Where were they cooking? :tarotwitc

[Fiamma]

I think the term "Kitchen Witch" may very well be a "newer" term,but kitchens aren't that modern. There had to be someone cooking in the castle for The King. :drool: And someone was cooking for The Pharoh. Where were they cooking? :tarotwitc


I agree that the *label* may be new, but the thing that the label describes is very old.

[Nitefalle]

Nitefalle, would you be so kind as to answer my questions about kitchen witchery being a modern invention.

Please see the post above yours. If I'm on your ignore list, that's perfectly fine, but I am curious to know why you feel that it is a modern invention.

Hi Xirian - um, you're certainly not on my ignore list, I meant to respond, but I've been under the weather and not online much over the weekend. An interesting conclusion to jump to, lol.

Anyway, yes, others here have expounded on it. The term is very new, and so I suppose in my brain, that equals new, because I never even thought about it before I heard the term years ago. So yes, I suppose it's not really a modern invention after all. My bad. :fpoke:

[Xirian]

Hi Xirian - um, you're certainly not on my ignore list, I meant to respond, but I've been under the weather and not online much over the weekend. An interesting conclusion to jump to, lol.
Hello,
Well, I didn't really think I was on your ignore list, but I was hoping to get your attention. I saw you post after mine about a post before mine. I posted on Friday, and really thought you had just overlooked the post all together.


Anyway, yes, others here have expounded on it. The term is very new, and so I suppose in my brain, that equals new, because I never even thought about it before I heard the term years ago. So yes, I suppose it's not really a modern invention after all. My bad. :fpoke:
I wasn't sure if you knew something that I was missing, because you also said something about the "Cottage witch phenomenon".

I don't really know if the terms are new or not. I would assume that the word "witch" attached to these kitchen and cottage are more than likely new, but I have no idea. I don't believe people actually thought they're doing magic or casting a spell when they did these little things. Even though that's exactly what they are doing.

Do you happen to know when these terms came about? You know, cottage witch and kitchen witch? Anyone can answer this question. I'm just curious.

[tigress42]

just wanted to say thanks to all that explained this... i was sort of wondering myself... new ish to paganism, trying to figure out where my path lies... and yeah - so far, looking like i'm eclectic in the sense that i dont fit down one alone (i like herbs and all the stuff related to it... i like energy work and diviniation.. i'm into equality for women but not in a strict only women can practice the way i do sort of way...) :P

so thanks again,
blessed be