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inkywitch
June 6th, 2007, 04:44 AM
As I read more about Asatru and Heathenry I notice that kin, family, friends and community are quite large parts of it. As are respect and courtesy.

I've noticed on a lot of Asatru LJ communities I lurk about that many people say you should respect you parents, they gave you life, etc.
I found it a little humorous that the community I had similar opinion to was called 'badheathens", lol.

I show my parents courtesy, just as I show anyone else I meet. Respect however, is something that I severely think is earned. Regardless of family ties or not. This is one major reason that arguments break out between my parents and I when my father 'demands respect because he is my father', yet this is usually when he is down right being rude, dis-courteous and showing me know respect at all. My mother usually chimes in with the, "He is your FATHER" speech. I'm an adult now, and I have my mind quite set on 'respect is earned not given' stance.

We're not entirely dysfunctional as a family unit. Alright, we kind of are. But not in an obvious way. My parents are quite different people to what they where bringing my sister and I up. My father now is letting his business die out, is not supporting his wife, let alone any children left under his roof, all because of a computer game he is addicted to (his virtual reality is better than his reality, and he has no desire to change it), and my mothers once fiery and strong nature has fizzled out under his constant verbal put-downs ("in humor" as he says) and she has become depressed and almost zombie-like when she thinks no one is looking from looking after his like one would look after a new born.

These people my parents have become are not people I admire. I am courteous and give thanks where thanks is due, don't get me wrong. I hold some love for the people they are deep down, or the people they were (especially my mother), but they have become so toxic and have no wish to do anything but live as they are and wish for death that I hold no respect for them anymore. I love them as my parents, but not as people. As people, I dislike them.

From people I have talked with and some sites I have read and lurked "good family ties" seem to be an important part of Asatru/Heathen life. Honoring/Respecting ancestors and elders, also. Blood (as in family) seems to be held in very high regard too.

My partner I consider family, we have no children at the moment so it's the two of us for now. He is non-religious currently and spirituality is not something we share, though common morals and ethics we do.

So where does one such as myself stand where most of my family is dysfunctional? And does being solitary for lack of like-minded community and family being involved in similar spirituality... I've pretty much lost my point after all the mind wandering and rambling. :lol: Yup, there it goes... I lost it.

Hærfest Leah
June 6th, 2007, 05:55 AM
Yes family is a big deal and so is honor and respect but they have to be earned.

We give respect where it is due not where it is demanded. Family and kin are not always blood related to us. We do not honor people blindly or we would not be Heathens at all.

I fail to believe anyone's family is wholly normal, their are a bit disfunctional in their own way. Do not feel bad that you think you are not being tru bcause you cannot truthfully have respect for a blood relative.

Rick
June 6th, 2007, 12:11 PM
Please don't take this in the wrong way, but I'm not sure that very many people have respect for their parents in their late teens-early twenties, Heathen or not. I think it's a biological response so that our parents will push us outta the nest, otherwise we'd always be cozy & comfy & never leave to go out & start our own families of children that don't respect us during the same age span.

I apologize if that came out preachy. I was just lookin' back at my attitudes then vs now. I tend to give respect 'til someone un-earns it... might just be me...

Vigdisdotter
June 6th, 2007, 12:32 PM
Of course respect must be earned :) that one goes without saying.

And while some would really like to make everything black and white, if you look at how the codes of conduct work, you'd notice that the inhospitable behavior that you spoke of would have been quite the eyebrow raiser in heathen circles. As such it would negate your responsibility of respect and courtesy (though it wouldn't be an excuse to be an ass in return).

This is a great example of a major principle of heathenism: active give and take as flows between participants.

Heathen ethics and conduct is far more complex (and elegant) then a list of Thou Shalts :)

Heart of All
June 6th, 2007, 01:36 PM
I don't know much about Heathen morals, but I wanted to say I'm in the same boat. I really, really want to respect and honor my parents, and I do a little bit with my Dad, but I just can't with my Mom. She demands I respect her because she's my mother, but at the same time treats me like a baby and says she always will. She criticizes everything about me and acts as if I am incapable of doing anything on my own. She hates her life, but refuses to act to change it because my parents and my brother all believe the point of life is to get by. And I don't believe that. I want to be happy. So we don't get along.

So yeah, empathy hugs.:hugz:

Hærfest Leah
June 6th, 2007, 04:28 PM
I don't know much about Heathen morals, but I wanted to say I'm in the same boat. I really, really want to respect and honor my parents, and I do a little bit with my Dad, but I just can't with my Mom. She demands I respect her because she's my mother, but at the same time treats me like a baby and says she always will. She criticizes everything about me and acts as if I am incapable of doing anything on my own. She hates her life, but refuses to act to change it because my parents and my brother all believe the point of life is to get by. And I don't believe that. I want to be happy. So we don't get along.

So yeah, empathy hugs.:hugz:

I've sent you a PM.

inkywitch
June 6th, 2007, 07:00 PM
Please don't take this in the wrong way, but I'm not sure that very many people have respect for their parents in their late teens-early twenties, Heathen or not. I think it's a biological response so that our parents will push us outta the nest, otherwise we'd always be cozy & comfy & never leave to go out & start our own families of children that don't respect us during the same age span.

I apologize if that came out preachy. I was just lookin' back at my attitudes then vs now. I tend to give respect 'til someone un-earns it... might just be me...

No, not preachy at all, and I totally get where your coming from.

I've been 'out of the nest' for about three years. This visit back home (and my parents have been trying to get me back home since I moved out) is only for 6 months while I wait for my partner to come home.

I also see where you come from saying you tend to give respect til' someone un-earns it. This happens with me too, with most people (though, I'm more caution with people now days do to past experience and stupidity). But in the case of my father, he has un-earned it. I used to respect him, even though he has been a passive force in my life, wholly for the reason he IS my father and he never did anything to make me think poorly of him.

After approx 8 years of verbal put downs, mainly towards Mum, which he claims 'is his sense of humor' and the way he has chose to live his life, I find I don't really have a ounce of respect for him. I will still talk with him, and not be rude, etc. I even tell him I love him and it's no lie. But it's not a lie that is allied with respect anymore, it's more allied with pity these days. I'm courteous and honest with him, and I try my hardest not to DISrespect him by the way I speak to him when we argue no matter what disgusting things he says to me.

It's not so simple as I'm young and don't understand what it's like to be a parent, or in their shoes. I hope, pray to the gods, I am never in the shoes their shoes to find out. The person my mother once was, that brought me up, brought me up to be better than settle for a man who is ignoring his clients, letting his business collapse around him, too lazy to even get his social security every fortnight all to sit on his arse creating debt while he plays Dungeons and Dragons Online 24/7 talking crap online to guild members and calling his wife names when she asks him to work a little this week so she can try and pay the mortgage on the house and the utilities.
He denies all responsibilities, and his actions effect the family. And mum's choice to stay all this time has too.
I guess this is part of what they mean when they speak of orlog?

Hmm.. you know it's a strange kind of love when very little respect and sometimes dislike is involved...

Rick
June 6th, 2007, 10:45 PM
Hmm.. you know it's a strange kind of love when very little respect and sometimes dislike is involved...
Nope, not strange at all. Unconditional love of a child for a parent. Makes me respect you more.

inkywitch
June 7th, 2007, 12:59 AM
Nope, not strange at all. Unconditional love of a child for a parent. Makes me respect you more.

Cheers. :cheers:

Eldred Grimm
June 13th, 2007, 05:37 PM
sounds like you have a very good head on your shoulders
so make a consscious effort if and when you raise your childern to do it defferntly than your parents did

inkywitch
June 13th, 2007, 06:28 PM
Ah yes. I've learned a lot about good parenting from their mistakes. I well be sure to do so when the time comes along! :)