View Full Version : Question about the Christian God and the Pagan Gods
-Sky-
August 21st, 2007, 08:53 AM
While i was on vacation i happened to start a religious conversation with the christian aunt of one of my friends.It was quite a long conversation in which i didn't speak much unfortunately.Anyway,when the conversation came to the essence of God she supported that only the Christian God is a real God because he is pure,above everything even the universe and energy because he created both of them and free of human sins and behaviour while in her opinion the Gods of the various pantheons(greek,roman,celtic) are not because they have human traits,emotions,they cheat,get angry,fall in love etc Of course i do not agree with her but at the time i didn't have a strong argument to oppose.What is your opinion on that?
aranarose
August 21st, 2007, 10:13 AM
God is a word defined by humans. It simply means a supernatural being, or higher power, or one of a pantheon of human-like entities worshipped by humans.
Dale Ivarie
August 21st, 2007, 10:23 AM
You might want to do a web search on "is god a Taoist" it is an excellent dialogue about the christian conception of god and freewill.
Personally I feel that the divine (god) is much more likely to have "written" spiritual lessons in the trees, the wind and the world around us...rather that having a roman emperor commison a "book" (the current new testement)
Dale
Nitefalle
August 21st, 2007, 11:23 AM
Well, first of all, just remember that that is her opinion and nothing more.
Secondly, while I definitely do NOT believe that humans created gods, in a way we create their images that we worship. We need something we can relate to, in my opinion. I think that is why I never felt anything in Church (I was raised Catholic) - the Christian God was just too far removed from everything, for me. How can I relate to a deity that has nothing to do with me except for the simple fact that he supposedly created the world and then split?
I think that a lot of myths are not to be taken literally, but rather allegories for how WE are supposed to act while here on earth, not necessarily stories of how the gods acted if/when they were "here". Does that make any sense?
aluokaloo
August 21st, 2007, 12:19 PM
in my opinion as a hard polytheist, every deity is different, some act more distant, and try to be above eartly pleasures others don't. I personall;y have an easier time with deities who make mistakes. Because they can understand me better. I was once posed the same question and couldn't answer it to m,y satisfaction and I have yet to get the chancem, but the powers that be created us in their image so that is a good answer for me personally. However that is just myopinion.
imapepper
August 21st, 2007, 12:29 PM
Well I would've reminded her of the bible saying God created humans in his image, so God obviously is more 'human' than we imagine and if God created everything, heck, even Satan, I doubt you could call him 'pure' in the Christian sense.
This woman needs to do a little deep thinking before putting such a huge gap between God and humans, even Gods son Jesus, who supposedly is God in the flesh, got angry, scared, sad, etc. and even questioned God saying "Why have you foresaken me?"
Those are all issues I would've bought up with her.
LostSheep
August 21st, 2007, 12:34 PM
While i was on vacation i happened to start a religious conversation with the christian aunt of one of my friends.It was quite a long conversation in which i didn't speak much unfortunately.Anyway,when the conversation came to the essence of God she supported that only the Christian God is a real God because he is pure,above everything even the universe and energy because he created both of them and free of human sins and behaviour while in her opinion the Gods of the various pantheons(greek,roman,celtic) are not because they have human traits,emotions,they cheat,get angry,fall in love etc Of course i do not agree with her but at the time i didn't have a strong argument to oppose.What is your opinion on that?
Actually that sounds pretty much like Plato's idea of the Prime Mover and that kind of idea... and you just need to take a look at a lot of the Old Testament, from Genesis onwards, to see how that version of God behaves pretty much like, if not worse than any of the Greek or Norse gods, cheerfully smiting whole nations all over the place.
Personally i think that' Jesus saw him as present in the world as well as a separate, distinct entity who was the creator and overseer of everything.
ModernKnight
August 21st, 2007, 12:37 PM
only the Christian God is a real God because he is pure,above everything even the universe and energy because he created both of them and free of human sins and behaviour while in her opinion the Gods of the various pantheons(greek,roman,celtic) are not because they have human traits,emotions,they cheat,get angry,fall in love
Your friend doesn't know what she's talking about. The Christian god is angry through most of the Old Testament. For example, "I the LORD your god am a jealous god." (Exodus 20:5) and "For the LORD will come in fire and his chariots like the whirlwind, to pay back his anger in fury and his rebuke in flames of fire." (Isaiah 66:15). The whole of the Book of Revelations is also about that god's anger.
imapepper
August 21st, 2007, 02:28 PM
Actually, in the Hebrew text the word "elohim" is used which would make it "Let's make man in OUR image". Who is "us"? ;)
Well I only used 'him' in the traditional Christian context, little ol' me however, doesn't ever refer to God as him, I say Mother and Father God or, God, or Creator...or even the Big Kahuna.
:hehehehe:
IvyWitch
August 21st, 2007, 02:52 PM
All Gods in every religion, including the monotheistic ones, have human-like qualities.
If they didn't, we as humans wouldn't be able to understand them.
-Sky-
August 21st, 2007, 03:10 PM
Thank you for all your responses!They helped a lot and cleared out things!:) I agree with most of you. I was quite angered while talking to her. I was trying to explain my point of view but she kept on talking.The argument begun when she asked me if i would go to church the next day and i said that the divine is in the sea,nature,the sky and i do not necessarily need to go in a church to revere it.She ended up thinking i am an atheist which is completely untrue.She claimed that she has travelled and studied a lot but all i saw was close-mindedness.I was especially bugged when quoting the testament she stated that all the other gods are demons.
We need something we can relate to, in my opinion. I think that is why I never felt anything in Church (I was raised Catholic) - the Christian God was just too far removed from everything, for me. How can I relate to a deity that has nothing to do with me except for the simple fact that he supposedly created the world and then split?
I think that a lot of myths are not to be taken literally, but rather allegories for how WE are supposed to act while here on earth, not necessarily stories of how the gods acted if/when they were "here". Does that make any sense?
I can relate to you Nitefalle.I was raised Christian as well and realised how distant that God was when i became aware of the Goddess.I was surprised by how involved she was in my life.Not only the Goddess,but the God(Cernunnos for me) as well.I have to admit that i felt close to Virgin Mary and still do,probably because i see her now as a facet of the Goddess.
As for the allegories,i agree.And was surprised that this woman who easily pointed out that for example the story of Aphrodite and her jealousy was ridiculous strongly believed that Eve,Adam,Paradise and the snake existed in reality.
Actually that sounds pretty much like Plato's idea of the Prime Mover and that kind of idea... and you just need to take a look at a lot of the Old Testament, from Genesis onwards, to see how that version of God behaves pretty much like, if not worse than any of the Greek or Norse gods, cheerfully smiting whole nations all over the place.
She did mention Plato as well supporting that he is revered by the Church as a pre-christianic philosopher.We have discussed this in my Philoshophy class and i believe that it is completely wrong to associate Plato with something that didn't even exist in his time.He was a philosopher not a religious person or a prophet.And just because some of his ideas suit the church it's not good to use him to their will.
latin_baller
August 21st, 2007, 03:42 PM
While i was on vacation i happened to start a religious conversation with the christian aunt of one of my friends.It was quite a long conversation in which i didn't speak much unfortunately.Anyway,when the conversation came to the essence of God she supported that only the Christian God is a real God because he is pure,above everything even the universe and energy because he created both of them and free of human sins and behaviour while in her opinion the Gods of the various pantheons(greek,roman,celtic) are not because they have human traits,emotions,they cheat,get angry,fall in love etc Of course i do not agree with her but at the time i didn't have a strong argument to oppose.What is your opinion on that?
Tell her that even if Yahweh (Judeo-Christian god) was so powerful, above everything else, with no human qualities, that he would not be as close to his followers than the more human-like gods like the Olympians.
You can also tell her about how Yahweh started out being called "El" and he was just one god of many in the Sumerian pantheon.
Or you can check out one of those websites that show the evils of the bible- http://www.evilbible.com/
In the end though, I dont think it really matters if you argue with her, no matter how much you prove her wrong, she will most likely continue to wallow in ignorance. I try to avoid those sorts of people, theyll find out when they die- during that moment when Ammut is licking her lips and there is no Jesus to save them:muwaha:muhuahaha!!!!
She did mention Plato as well supporting that he is revered by the Church as a pre-christianic philosopher.We have discussed this in my Philoshophy class and i believe that it is completely wrong to associate Plato with something that didn't even exist in his time.
I completely agree, Just he had some views that the church also had does not mean he would even support it, just like Akhenaten...
David19
August 21st, 2007, 06:37 PM
Personally, I'd just say that no god is "perfect" and they all have human-like personalities (e.g. feel happiness, anger, jealously, etc) and that even YHWH does have a personality - he's a jealous god, he'll strike down anyone who crosses him, he'll f*** you up if you try to hurt someone/thing he cares about or his people, IMO, he has a very cool personality
David19
August 21st, 2007, 06:39 PM
In the end though, I dont think it really matters if you argue with her, no matter how much you prove her wrong, she will most likely continue to wallow in ignorance. I try to avoid those sorts of people, theyll find out when they die- during that moment when Ammut is licking her lips and there is no Jesus to save them:muwaha:muhuahaha!!!!
Just wanted to say, Christians probably won't end up in the Kemetic afterlife 'cause it's not their afterlife, just as a Heathen or Wiccan won't have to face Hall of Judgement or Ammut, etc 'cause it's not part of their path (not everyone goes to the same place).
Fiamma
August 21st, 2007, 06:52 PM
Well, the Bible certainly seems to contradict that opinion. Next time ask her if God is so free of human impulses and emotions, then why does the bible speak so much of the wrath and the jealousy and love of God, and what he wants of his people?
Sounds like someone needs to read her Bible...
While i was on vacation i happened to start a religious conversation with the christian aunt of one of my friends.It was quite a long conversation in which i didn't speak much unfortunately.Anyway,when the conversation came to the essence of God she supported that only the Christian God is a real God because he is pure,above everything even the universe and energy because he created both of them and free of human sins and behaviour while in her opinion the Gods of the various pantheons(greek,roman,celtic) are not because they have human traits,emotions,they cheat,get angry,fall in love etc Of course i do not agree with her but at the time i didn't have a strong argument to oppose.What is your opinion on that?
latin_baller
August 21st, 2007, 08:24 PM
Just wanted to say, Christians probably won't end up in the Kemetic afterlife 'cause it's not their afterlife, just as a Heathen or Wiccan won't have to face Hall of Judgement or Ammut, etc 'cause it's not part of their path (not everyone goes to the same place).
There is NO (christian) HEAVEN OR HELL. I think mostly all Christians are doomed to have no afterlife at all.
So what if its "not part of their path"? There HAS to be false beliefs. If I go make up my own religion with made-up gods and an aftrerlife designed on the wonka factory that doesnt mean that Ill go to the wonka factory when I die. Many people from different religion claim their certain god created the universe- they cant ALL be right.
I do believe other religions are true (or at least mostly), like Hinduism, but others are completely false.
Fiamma
August 21st, 2007, 09:56 PM
There is NO (christian) HEAVEN OR HELL. I think mostly all Christians are doomed to have no afterlife at all.
So what if its "not part of their path"? There HAS to be false beliefs. If I go make up my own religion with made-up gods and an aftrerlife designed on the wonka factory that doesnt mean that Ill go to the wonka factory when I die. Many people from different religion claim their certain god created the universe- they cant ALL be right.
I do believe other religions are true (or at least mostly), like Hinduism, but others are completely false.
So um, why is Christianity special and completely false but not Hinduism (other than because you don't like it)
Fiamma
August 21st, 2007, 09:58 PM
So what if its "not part of their path"? There HAS to be false beliefs. If I go make up my own religion with made-up gods and an aftrerlife designed on the wonka factory that doesnt mean that Ill go to the wonka factory when I die. Many people from different religion claim their certain god created the universe- they cant ALL be right.
hon, why don't you go take a look at some quantum theory and see what that does for your beliefs of what's possible and impossible and what might or might not exist?
ModernKnight
August 21st, 2007, 10:16 PM
She did mention Plato as well supporting that he is revered by the Church as a pre-christianic philosopher.We have discussed this in my Philoshophy class and i believe that it is completely wrong to associate Plato with something that didn't even exist in his time.He was a philosopher not a religious person or a prophet.And just because some of his ideas suit the church it's not good to use him to their will.
Then remind her that Plato didn't believe in the idea of an immortal soul.
latin_baller
August 21st, 2007, 11:55 PM
So um, why is Christianity special and completely false but not Hinduism (other than because you don't like it)
Why wouldnt you think Christianity is false? If it were true that would mean you are going to hell.
Its false because whole bunch of things were made up or stolen. There was no Jewish Hell, Christians created the idea of Hell to scare people. They stole that from the Norse Hel, also with elements from the seven-gated Sumerian underworld.
If you research you will find out how popes decree things and suddenly whole supernatural worlds are there or gone. things like limbo or purgatory were made-up out of thin air by popes. I know pope benedict was recently trying to do away with something I think limbo (?). So all these things just get invented.
hon, why don't you go take a look at some quantum theory and see what that does for your beliefs of what's possible and impossible and what might or might not exist?
It doesnt do anything. These modern atheist scientists are barely discovering what Egyptians knew through the knowledge of Thoth. ie They knew the universe contracted and expanded, something Stephen Hawking and these other guys barely just found out. For hundreds of years scientists held the Greek theory that the universe was infinite...
No FURTHER ARGUEMENT WITH YOU.:wave:
Zibblsnrt
August 22nd, 2007, 12:47 AM
Or you can check out one of those websites that show the evils of the bible- http://www.evilbible.com/
In the end though, I dont think it really matters if you argue with her, no matter how much you prove her wrong, she will most likely continue to wallow in ignorance. I try to avoid those sorts of people, theyll find out when they die- during that moment when Ammut is licking her lips and there is no Jesus to save them:muwaha:muhuahaha!!!!
There is NO (christian) HEAVEN OR HELL. I think mostly all Christians are doomed to have no afterlife at all.
So what if its "not part of their path"? There HAS to be false beliefs. If I go make up my own religion with made-up gods and an aftrerlife designed on the wonka factory that doesnt mean that Ill go to the wonka factory when I die. Many people from different religion claim their certain god created the universe- they cant ALL be right.
I do believe other religions are true (or at least mostly), like Hinduism, but others are completely false.
Why wouldnt you think Christianity is false? If it were true that would mean you are going to hell.
Its false because whole bunch of things were made up or stolen. There was no Jewish Hell, Christians created the idea of Hell to scare people. They stole that from the Norse Hel, also with elements from the seven-gated Sumerian underworld.
Christianity is not exempt from this site's policy about bashing any religion. Doesn't matter if it's strictest Gallic reconstructionism, Christianity, Scientology, autoapotheosis or whatever.
I don't particularly care if someone thinks a religion is evil or invalid (indeed, there are some I consider to be either or both) but they (and I) don't get to say as much on this site.
Fiamma
August 22nd, 2007, 03:17 AM
Why wouldnt you think Christianity is false? If it were true that would mean you are going to hell.
I have know absolute way of knowing if I am or not. I certainly don't believe I am, but everyone has just as much chance of being wrong as the next guy. There's only one way to find out for sure and I have no plans to do that anytime soon. And even if we aren't all going to hell, it doesn't mean that every single solitary detail of Christianity is across the board wrong.
Its false because whole bunch of things were made up or stolen.
If this is the case, then every religion that's ever existed is false.
There was no Jewish Hell,
So? Christianity isn't Judaism.
Christians created the idea of Hell to scare people.
They stole that from the Norse Hel, also with elements from the seven-gated Sumerian underworld.
The idea of punishment in the afterlife did not originate with Christianity, and perhaps the name "Hell" might be a derivative of "Hel" but the concept is hardly that recent.
If you research you will find out how popes decree things and suddenly whole supernatural worlds are there or gone. things like limbo or purgatory were made-up out of thin air by popes. I know pope benedict was recently trying to do away with something I think limbo (?). So all these things just get invented.
So the Pope speaks for all of Christianity? Who knows...maybe they all do exist and the Pope is trying to say they don't to make Catholicism look better. I see what you're trying to say but the logic is flawed and one thing does not prove another.
LostSheep
August 22nd, 2007, 03:54 AM
Christians created the idea of Hell to scare people.
They stole that from the Norse Hel, also with elements from the seven-gated Sumerian underworld. :eyebrow:
LostSheep
August 22nd, 2007, 04:05 AM
If you research you will find out how popes decree things and suddenly whole supernatural worlds are there or gone. things like limbo or purgatory were made-up out of thin air by popes. I know pope benedict was recently trying to do away with something I think limbo (?). So all these things just get invented.: So on the one hand, Christian leaders are attacked for holding rigid, fixed dogma that never changes in the light of scientific advances, etc., and then on the other they're also attacked when they do change this dogma in the light of later developments in scientific and theolgical thinking? :(
Cassie
August 22nd, 2007, 04:52 AM
Christians created the idea of Hell to scare people. They stole that from the Norse Hel, also with elements from the seven-gated Sumerian underworld.
Hel (http://www.polandforvisitors.com/travel_poland/hel) does exist, and it is quite pleasent. A friend of mine was there recently.
More seriously, Christianity is not the only religion that believes in Hell or some other form of eternal or severe punishment. One of Latin_Baller's earlier comments indicates that he himself believes in something as equally unpleasent as the Christian concept of hell;
theyll find out when they die- during that moment when Ammut is licking her lips and there is no Jesus to save them..
I do agree with another comment he made though that some people are unable to discuss religious matters openly without their own beliefs and prejudices getting in the way (which seemed to be the case with the woman Sky was talking to in the op). The problem is, it is easy enough to spot when someone else is acting in that way but we tend to be a bit blind to our own prejudices and mis-conceptions.
Tullip Troll
August 22nd, 2007, 05:40 AM
the bible shows GOd getting angry and jealous.
However Gods with feelings hardly seems like a weakness.
ap Dafydd
August 22nd, 2007, 06:32 AM
Human beings take little bits of the Divine and make them into gods, Christians are no different from this. Because we are human beings, the gods we make are focused on human concerns and have human characteristics.
Sorry, but I can't be doing with creationism in any guise.
gwyn eich byd
Ffred
latin_baller
August 22nd, 2007, 08:52 AM
Ooooh it looks like "The Treacherous Human Scumbag" had to ruin it...
Xentor
August 22nd, 2007, 09:39 AM
Ooooh it looks like "The Treacherous Human Scumbag" had to ruin it...
Read the rules about responding to admin modes, please, and adhere to them.
David19
August 22nd, 2007, 06:28 PM
There is NO (christian) HEAVEN OR HELL. I think mostly all Christians are doomed to have no afterlife at all.
So what if its "not part of their path"? There HAS to be false beliefs. If I go make up my own religion with made-up gods and an aftrerlife designed on the wonka factory that doesnt mean that Ill go to the wonka factory when I die. Many people from different religion claim their certain god created the universe- they cant ALL be right.
I do believe other religions are true (or at least mostly), like Hinduism, but others are completely false.
Fiamma provided an excellant response, but what makes you think the Christian afterlife is "false" compared to all the others?, besides, there's quite a few near death experiences to convince me that their afterlife is real (and not just of the heavenly variety, quite a few seem to go to Hell too, I just don't believe the Christian afterlife is for everyone).
David19
August 22nd, 2007, 06:29 PM
hon, why don't you go take a look at some quantum theory and see what that does for your beliefs of what's possible and impossible and what might or might not exist?
I can't give you karma right now, but great post :).
Adrianus
August 23rd, 2007, 01:15 AM
I do agree with another comment he made though that some people are unable to discuss religious matters openly without their own beliefs and prejudices getting in the way (which seemed to be the case with the woman Sky was talking to in the op). The problem is, it is easy enough to spot when someone else is acting in that way but we tend to be a bit blind to our own prejudices and mis-conceptions.
Yes indeed.
Adrianus
August 23rd, 2007, 01:26 AM
hon, why don't you go take a look at some quantum theory and see what that does for your beliefs of what's possible and impossible and what might or might not exist?
Yes. Quantum theory is very interesting.
CryssieWillow
August 25th, 2007, 12:47 PM
Ik you create you automaticly put something of yourself in your creation. You cannot create a child out of nothing, you cannot sing a flawless aria if you cannot sing on key or make pottery if you don't know how to work with clay.
I don't think it is any different with Gods.
A flawless creature of pure light goodness and love cannot create creatures that are flawed(human traits), have bad sides or are downright evil, because the God has none of those traits so would not be able to create them, and such mistakes cannot be made by accident because the God is flawless.
So the conclusion follows that either the God is question is "flawed" or there is something seriously wrong with our perspective on perfection :P
But if we take the bible at it's word the God of the Desert is arrogant, proud, jealous and vindictive. I do not think he is any less "human" than our Pagan Gods. :cheers:
Modesty
December 28th, 2008, 12:15 PM
Interesting question. If she believes that God does not have any human traits as emotions, anger, love, etc. then how does she explain God making humans to begin with and instilling in them those traits? In order for a creator to make something, they themselves have to know what they are creating. By laying waste to Sodom and Gomorrah was that act not lead by disgust and then anger? By implanting Jesus in the womb of Mary was that not an act of love? In order for one to show another emotions and give another emotions, one must have these emotions first.
While i was on vacation i happened to start a religious conversation with the christian aunt of one of my friends.It was quite a long conversation in which i didn't speak much unfortunately.Anyway,when the conversation came to the essence of God she supported that only the Christian God is a real God because he is pure,above everything even the universe and energy because he created both of them and free of human sins and behaviour while in her opinion the Gods of the various pantheons(greek,roman,celtic) are not because they have human traits,emotions,they cheat,get angry,fall in love etc Of course i do not agree with her but at the time i didn't have a strong argument to oppose.What is your opinion on that?
Cunae
December 28th, 2008, 04:38 PM
I think what we don't understand about (the) God is what motivates Him. We only see Him from our very limited human perspective. It's like seeing a raindrop and having no concept about the process that causes it.
Christ, however, is God made flesh to dwell among us. God is revealed in the words and actions of Christ as documented by the NT. I think we could study it for a lifetime and still only understand a bit of who God is.
I do recall, however, that Jesus was pretty pissed off when He found the moneychangers in the temple, He experienced dread and fear in the Garden before He was crucified, and He was both amused and annoyed by His disciples at times. So, yeah, I think God has those emotions. The motives make them different from ours.
watersprite
December 28th, 2008, 04:44 PM
Well, The "our" has been covered up from the beginning of the Christan church.
DoktorSick
December 28th, 2008, 07:59 PM
she obviously hasn't read the bible.It has many examples and text saying god is jealous and gets angry and those are both human trait.
cydira
December 29th, 2008, 12:02 PM
First off... please pardon me as I beat my head against my desk.**THUD**
Now that I've finished with *that* :twitch: I think I can move on to what I wanted to say.
This person who is telling you that the Christian God is 'pure' and implying that other gods are not really should define what they mean by pure. As others have said, the implied definition of purity seems to be that the Christian God does not display 'petty human traits' and that's an belief that is rooted in ignorance.
I agree with the exhortations of everyone thus far for this person to sit down and actually read their bible. There are examples given of the Jewish and Christian God displaying just about every emotion known to humanity, with the exception of lust (unless you say that the Song of Songs is the Christian/Jewish God romancing the soul of the believer :smileroll ). This person will get upset, I'm sure, as it is pointed out to them that the human traits of jelousy, anger, and violence that are usually described as 'petty' are also present in their God.
If I were you, since this is a family member, for the sake of familial harmony, don't press the issue unless you have to. This is generally very uncomfortable ground for Christians who don't have a reasonably complete education as to their faith. When they're pressed, the reactions tend to turn into personal attacks and are generally just vicious because they feel threatened and as though you are attacking them. I've seen this happen more times then I can count, so proceed with caution.
Now, if you're of a mind to put a bee in their bonnet, it is possible that you could coax out of them their understanding of what the traits of the Christian God are and then lay waste to their argument by clearly demonstrating the heresy they are perpetuating in their ignorance. That'd require having a significant knowledge of the Bible and the theology of their particular sect of Christianity, as well as the writings of theologians such as St. Augustine.
I'd only go to there if you didn't want to talk to this person again and didn't care if you set off World War 3 in your family, though. Other wise, just smile nod and leave it at "That is your opinion and we're free to disagree." Because if you're not looking for a fight, you shouldn't start to tell this person how they are misunderstanding and misrepresenting their faith. It always turns ugly, especially if you are dealing with someone who is functionally illiterate about their faith. It doesn't matter if it's Christianity, Judaism, or any pagan faith on the planet.
It's extremely rare to find someone who is willing to discuss things like theology and do so from a position requiring an open mind, let alone discuss the matter with someone of a different faith.
Now... I can't help it, this thing is driving me crazy and I have this horrible feeling that some one may actually believe the hogwash about how the Jewish and Christian concept of Hell was stolen from the Norse. I saw that on the screen and I had to restrain the urge to yell at the screen because I didn't want to wake up my son from his nap.
The concept of 'Hell' as it is presented in the popular imagery and such is dramatically different from the concept as espoused in various other belief systems and is drawn more from Dante's Inferno then anything else. The early Christians really didn't have too much contact with the Norse and the Sumerian influence upon the Jewish concept of 'Hell' is limited. It makes me want to scream when I hear or read about some one insisting these kinds of nonsensical things are true because the evidence just doesn't support the argument at all.
Pardon me, I had to get that out before I went nuts! :)
Anteros
December 29th, 2008, 03:25 PM
I think the myths of the gods confuse people. The gods are not their myths, and we as pagans don't treat them as sacred scripture given by divine revelation.
I found this on the Elaion website:
In contrast, our relationship to mythology is distinct from the way that, for instance, a Muslim would approach the Koran; our stories are not revealed to us by God, but created by man in their attempt to approach the divine.
from: http://elaion.org/FAQ.htm#Hell9
The pagan gods don't actually possess these human flaws as they do in their myths, and we recognize that the poets created these myths to understand the gods, but they aren't meant to be taken literally.
However, if you read the Bible, God is angry, jealous, vengeful, judgmental... possessing quite a few petty human emotions, and unlike pagan myths, the Bible/Koran/Torah *is* sacred scripture believed to have been revealed by God. People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones ;)
David19
December 30th, 2008, 09:17 PM
I think the myths of the gods confuse people. The gods are not their myths, and we as pagans don't treat them as sacred scripture given by divine revelation.
I found this on the Elaion website:
from: http://elaion.org/FAQ.htm#Hell9
The pagan gods don't actually possess these human flaws as they do in their myths, and we recognize that the poets created these myths to understand the gods, but they aren't meant to be taken literally.
However, if you read the Bible, God is angry, jealous, vengeful, judgmental... possessing quite a few petty human emotions, and unlike pagan myths, the Bible/Koran/Torah *is* sacred scripture believed to have been revealed by God. People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones ;)
While that can be can be true, I do believe the Gods do have emotions, they can get jealous, angry, happy, etc, I'm a Sumerian recon, and, while the Myths aren't seen as literal events (as in historical), they are seen as describing real events, if that makes any sense (e.g. Inanna did descend to the Kur/the Underworld, and she did try to take it over, etc, but, it happened in the spiritual/supernatural realms, not on this realm). I hope that made some sense.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.1.10 Copyright © 2012 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.