Tim
January 6th, 2010, 12:09 PM
This is a blog I came across, and my reply. I don't know if the reply will be approved, but have cross-posted it in several places to get the widest exposure because I believe Ruadhán's observations are worth of greater discussion.
The Two Primary Branches of Hellenic Religion
written by Ruadhán McElroy
I’ve come to the conclusion that the modern state of the Hellenismos/Hellenic polytheism/Hellenic religionist (HP, for short) community is like the current state of my laurel — or that old pussy willow tree that one of the neighbours had when I was a kid in Toledo:
Above the roots that are shared by the entirety of the community, there are two apparent “main branches” split above an almost-nonexistent trunk. Each of these two has several smaler branches, and some of those branches are populated by even smaller branches.
Read the rest of this entry » (http://urban.hellenistai.com/?p=128) My reply:
This was a very well written blog. My only criticism is the classification of these two groups as “intellectual” and “spiritual” because it implies what you seem to be arguing against... that one is automatically more or less spiritual and the other more or less intelligent. However, for the very reasons you stated (and Gavin's statement that "worshipping the same gods is not enough to make someone a co-religionist when everything else is completely different"), I have started to refer those practicing (what you call) the "spiritual religion" as Celebrants.
Those who define Hellenismos as the traditional polytheistic religion of Ancient Greece are concerned with the ethics, practices, values, traditions, rituals, and texts traditionally associated with the Hellenic religion, and see religiosity inseparable from spirituality. Recons believe strongly that one needs to spend time studying the religion, practicing the rituals, and adhering to certain forms, and do not recognize those who do not aspire to orthopraxy as practicing Hellenismos.
On the other hand, Celebrants seem to feel validity of one's beliefs is expressed in inspired actions of the heart, and not concerned with ritual format, tradition, ethics or ideals, and use what they "feel fits," tossing out what seems awkward to them. Very simply, the values and judgments of the two groups are mutually exclusive and ultimately incompatible.
ETA: I'm not really interested in debating the validity of Ruadhán's or my opinions on this subject... just putting them both out there.
The Two Primary Branches of Hellenic Religion
written by Ruadhán McElroy
I’ve come to the conclusion that the modern state of the Hellenismos/Hellenic polytheism/Hellenic religionist (HP, for short) community is like the current state of my laurel — or that old pussy willow tree that one of the neighbours had when I was a kid in Toledo:
Above the roots that are shared by the entirety of the community, there are two apparent “main branches” split above an almost-nonexistent trunk. Each of these two has several smaler branches, and some of those branches are populated by even smaller branches.
Read the rest of this entry » (http://urban.hellenistai.com/?p=128) My reply:
This was a very well written blog. My only criticism is the classification of these two groups as “intellectual” and “spiritual” because it implies what you seem to be arguing against... that one is automatically more or less spiritual and the other more or less intelligent. However, for the very reasons you stated (and Gavin's statement that "worshipping the same gods is not enough to make someone a co-religionist when everything else is completely different"), I have started to refer those practicing (what you call) the "spiritual religion" as Celebrants.
Those who define Hellenismos as the traditional polytheistic religion of Ancient Greece are concerned with the ethics, practices, values, traditions, rituals, and texts traditionally associated with the Hellenic religion, and see religiosity inseparable from spirituality. Recons believe strongly that one needs to spend time studying the religion, practicing the rituals, and adhering to certain forms, and do not recognize those who do not aspire to orthopraxy as practicing Hellenismos.
On the other hand, Celebrants seem to feel validity of one's beliefs is expressed in inspired actions of the heart, and not concerned with ritual format, tradition, ethics or ideals, and use what they "feel fits," tossing out what seems awkward to them. Very simply, the values and judgments of the two groups are mutually exclusive and ultimately incompatible.
ETA: I'm not really interested in debating the validity of Ruadhán's or my opinions on this subject... just putting them both out there.