Astrology Q and A

[Litha]

This is a new thread, not for indepth chart delineation, but to help answer questions. Have a general astrological question? Post it and lets all try to answer it :)

[wiccamags]

I have aways been interested in Astrology, but could not understand the whole cusps asending and desending. In England they have started a fortnightly build up magazine all about Astrology, which includes A charting table, tarot cards and runes.
Do you think this would be of help to me. What sort of information would you need to make a birth chart?

[Litha]

Cusps are the dividing lines between the houses, of which there are twelve. Generally when a planet makes aspects to a house, it is felt the strongest when it is entering and leaving that house. If there is a planet in that house that the transiting planet may make aspects to, as the transiting planet aspects closer to exact, it is ascending. After it has reached exact and passed on, that transiting planet may still be in descending aspect to the house planet.

The basic information you need tomake a birthchart is the day of birth, time and place. The mathematical work involves many different charts (longitude, latitude, GMT, planetary scientific ewohemeris)and about 4-5 pages of logarithmic calculation. Perhaps the kit you mention has some shortcut charts so that no math is rquired, but this may result in one that is not as accurate.

If I could have a gander at the items that this magazine wants to sell, it would help. I wonder what this charting table is about? Tarot and Runes are methods of divination that have astrological ties, eg the Astrological card for Aquarius is the Star card. Many people use these tools together so it's interesting that they include them all in this package you describe. It is quite a lot of work to learn all three, but you don't have to all at once. If you'd like to have them all and the cost is not prohibitive, then look to the quality of the items before you make any decisions.

[mol]

You always give so much information! Sometimes I just cant take it all IN!!! :)

Let me ask a realllllly basic question. What are the Houses? Are they the Signs?

[Litha]

Ah, when I'm in lerning mode, I am in Mind Suck, like a vaccum vortex wanting more more more!
When I'm in teaching mode I guess that energy works the same way but outward, but don't let me info bomb you.
Take human bites (:

There are three basics:
Signs, Planets and Houses.
The Planets represent WHAT energy is operating, the Zodiac Signs describe HOW that energy gets modified and the Houses show WHERE in life it happens.
Take a look at your astrological chart and you'll see that it is has divisions in the chart circle. It looks like a sliced pizza pie. Each slice/house represents an aspect in your life. A more indepth delination of each house can be found in the House Keywords thread, but here's the quick and dirty:
First House (Self)
Second House (Money, Valuables)
Third House (Communication, Learning)
Fourth House (Home & Family)
Fifth House (Creative talents)
Sixth House (Health & Work)
Seventh House (Partnership, Marriage)
Eighth House (Inheritance, Sex, Death)
Ninth House (Education, Ideals)
Tenth House (Career, Reputation)
Eleventh House ( Friendships)
Twelfth House ( Things hidden, Secrets)

[mol]

Now, see...I got the grasp of that...that is what we need, Litha. We need for you to teach in smaller bytes (sorry, geek here). The information you gave earlier is great, but sometimes i get lost in the fold. But this lesson I grasped as soon as I finished reading it.

Thanks....and next..whatever you think is relevant FIRST.

[Litha]

Gotcha!

[mol]

Originally posted by Litha
Gotcha!

Well, what else you got?

:)

[Litha]

Moon in Scorpio
February 12 2001

The Scorpio moon has us searching for truths, for meanings and for passion but a fast moving square aspect from the moon to Neptune makes it difficult for us to find our answers in the outer world. It is the perfect opportunity to spend some quality time with our souls, investigating what is important to us and coming to terms with our strongest and most compelling desires.

What house does Scorpio fall in you chart?

credit to Mark Husson and Hay House
for learning purposes only

[mol]

Originally posted by Litha
Moon in Scorpio
February 12 2001

The Scorpio moon has us searching for truths, for meanings and for passion but a fast moving square aspect from the moon to Neptune makes it difficult for us to find our answers in the outer world. It is the perfect opportunity to spend some quality time with our souls, investigating what is important to us and coming to terms with our strongest and most compelling desires.

What house does Scorpio fall in you chart?

credit to Mark Husson and Hay House
for learning purposes only


My Ninth House?

[mol]

Originally posted by mol

My Ninth House?

Ack! I am not sure if that is right or not.

[Armitage]

I have a quick question...What does it mean if all water in your chart is in Scorpio...As well as Sun and Asc.?

[Litha]

Scorpio falls in both your 2nd and 3rd house mol. The Scorptio glyph is the the one that looks like an M with a pointy tail. It's interesting to monitor where the moon is, since she affects the house she falls in with the flavor of the sign she's in. So the Moon is in Scorpio for everyone at the same time, but in different houses, depending on each of our charts (:
Armitage's Scorpio flavor not only his Sun but also his Ascendant. The Sun is your persona and the Ascendant is the mask you present to the world. Since both are the same sign, when anyone meets you, Armitage, what they see is what they get! And what is that? Well Scorpios are like pitbulls. They never give up.
Water is the elemnt of emotion and with that element in Scorpio, you are vibrant, magnetic, passionate, you value self-control, gravitate toward power and aim for the highest...or lowest. Perceptive, emotional, sensual, all your senses are alert and you experience life fully. You are very good at digging out secrets and are fascinated by mystery. You can also be vengeful, unforgiving and obssesive. It can be difficult to life yourself up when down in the dumps. Other signs cannot understand the bleak despair that pulls you, yet this is an essential part of Scorpio. Ultimately you fight your way back towards renewal and transformation, finding yourself anew, again and again.

[mol]

3rd and 4th!! Ahhh...I am not looking at that chart right. How can I be so dense at certain things..

[Litha]

I wouldn't say dense :P not at all, it's kinda wierd when youy first look at a 12 slice pizza pie and say THIS is my life?

[richardcranium]

I am a bit of a lazy guy and all this stuff seems like a lot of work to do. Is there an easier way to do this?

[Selenia]

after studying astrology off and on for the past 5 yrs,
somehow I don't think so (:
but if anyone does find an easier way, let me know!

[richardcranium]

Have someone else do it for you. But, how reliable are news papers, TV guides, etc....?

[Selenia]

I guess astrocolumns are reliable to a certain extent, but they only deal with a unilateral aspect of it all since the use is only for the sun and the aspects it makes.
There is still Mercury, venus, Mars, Saturn, Jupiter, Uranus, Neptune and Pluto to account for in each individual's personal horoscope that these columns don't even touch on.

[richardcranium]

Is that good enough?

[Selenia]

well, it's kind of like getting a whiff of dinner without a taste!

[PaganBoyNC]

Can you explain the relationship of the sun sign and the ascendant? I understand that the sun sign is the sign the sun was in when you were born and the ascendant is the sign that was just going over the horizon, but whenever I read descriptions of what a sun sign means and what an ascendant means they always sound so similar. Thanks in advance :).

[Selenia]

The essential players, those with the energy of the chart are the planets. They are the What of the chart. The houses that the planets enact their energies in are the Where of the chart.
The ascendant is the left side of the median division of the chart with the right side being the descendant. These points are where a planets energies can effect.

The Sun rules will power and ego. It is the core of your potential and uniqueness as an individual; who you are and what you are about.
Your Sun Sign represents the main direction and focus you want your life to take and your determination to accomplish what you set out to do. It represents your personal honesty and integrity, your ability to command respect and authority and your capacity to impress and influence others.


You're correct in explaining, the ascendant (or rising sign) is the sign that was on the horizon at the exact time of your birth. To calculate it, you need a birthdate, birthtime and birthplace.

Your ascendant is the beginning of things.
It describes how others see you when they first meet you, your appearance and it is the impression you first make on others.
A Cancer ascendant may have a “moon- like” face with round features and expressive eyes.
If you have an Aries ascendant and a Virgo sun sign, you may come off strong at first, but as people get to know you, they find you are actually quite unassuming.

this is what I have in my own notes from the subject taken down loooong ago!

[Litha]

fab explanation!
The ascendant represent the "you" that the outside world percieves, as well as personality traits, needs and your physical characteristics. It is your outward manifestation and the way you express yourself, which is probably why the world perceives you that way.Usually your sun sign and ascendant are different, which is why your ascendant is percieved as a "mask" most of the time hiding your true self, your sun sign.
The Sun is your self, your willpower, your strongest representation of who you really are.

[BrightStar]

Hi all!
I have a question.A friend gave birth to a beautiful baby boy yesterday,March 21 at 6:04 am CST.He would be an Aries right?Not a pisces as he was born the day after the equinox.Kind of a cusp though,wouldn't ya say?
Peace and Love
Rain Brightstar

[Litha]

hmmm, kinda sorta
the child would have been considered a "cusper" had he been born on the day of the change
how glorious to have the blessings of both the spring equinox and the aries ingress!
Happy Ostara Baby!!!!

[BrightStar]

Hi all!
I have been looking at the 6th House of my chart.Jupiter is in Sagittarius,which takes up over half to 2/3 of the House.Then it goes to Capricorn,with Saturn in there at the tail end.I think Saturn would have more influence on this house,being at the end.But Jupiter is a HUGE planet,so I would think its energy on Sagittarius would have quite and effect too.How does this work out?Also,when a sign comes at the end of a house,does it necessarily have more influence,like when 2 planets are in one sign and in the house and then a new sign comes in at the end?
Peace and Love
Rain BrightStar

[Litha]

the beginning of the house/end of the house are very important: you mention the entering cusp of the 6th and the entering cusp of the7th:

as the planets move about in the sky, they affect your chart occurs with their transits.
If a planet's transit affects an important spot in your chart, you will very likely have something going on in relation to the area that the panet touches.

with your 6th house Sag with Jupiter there....say the Sun hit that spot in your chart, with a trine, you might have a big day at work where you are gettin gyour 15 minutes of fame...perhaps a big project that you have to do a presentation on and all eyes are on you.

or that transiting Venus made an aspect here your 6th ends/7th house begins with this Cap/Saturn influence that is there natally...you might have a romantic relationship that takes a more serious turn, one of commitment perhaps

these are just some possiblities, the signs and planets are connected to so many kinds of keywords, that sometimes it is very usefull to string together an astroalphabet as I've mentioned of what each planet, house, sign mean together in conjunction with the aspect that is being made (eg, trine, opposition, suqare. etc) with the transiting planet. You could study you own chart all the do long day!

[BrightStar]

Hi!
I was just trying to do astrosentences using the keywords for my 6th house.Do I use both signs and planets?I'm still trying to learn the basics.
Peace and Love
Rain BrightStar

[Litha]

use signs and planets and houses too!

like Sag 6th house jupiter
would be independent expansive health/work

[BrightStar]

Hi!
Thanks for helping,Litha.
So,would my Saturn at the end of the 6th house in Capricorn,effect my 7th house too?Since my 7th house has so much Capricorn in it and the planet is in that sign?
Peace and Love
rain BrightStar

[Litha]

thanks for the question :)
what degree is Saturn at in your 6th house and what degree is your decendant angle/beginning of 7th house?

[BrightStar]

Hi all!
According to your post on 2-20-2001 in the What's Your Sign Baby? thread,Saturn is in my 6th House at 11 degrees Capricorn and my descendant/7th House begins at 13 degrees Capricorn.
Peace and Love
Rain BrightStar

[Litha]

2 degree is pretty dang close!
I would read Saturn as affecting both the 6th and 7th houses in your natal chart.

planets have import when they are anywhere within a house, but have more weight when close to the house cusps, just entering or just leaving a house.
You'll find that if a transiting planet makes aspects to a particular house, the planet as it's greatest effect just as it enters and leaves the house it is aspecting.

sometime a transiting planet with reach a point, then go retrograde back over it and then station direct and set that point of a third time and this is usally a marker of something significant occuring in that person's lfe.
One ofthese days I'll purchase one of those neato computer programs with all the bells and whistles and learn how to use it so I can calculate all those kinds of exact transits.

but back to the question, there are those astrologers that even read a planet this close to be in the 7th house just from it's proximity. The way I see it you should read it in both since the planet IS in the 6th house but close to the 7th.

no matter how you slice it, Saturn is a presence that really makes himself known, so you'll be very aware if he square dancing on you chart!

[BrightStar]

Hi!
OK,I kind of thought that's what was going on.My calculations had it in the 7th house,but it is actually in the 6th,which confused me.You've cleared things up nicely.
Thank you!
Now,next week I'll probably have a whole bunch of confusing questions on another subject.Astrology is kind of hard for me,but I like it.Having been a Social sciences major in college,my math skills aren't that strong.So I get confused.I thought I should practice all this on me,with my chart, before I do anybody else.
Peace and love
Rain BrightStar

[Litha]

it's always good to know yourself first. You'll find as you astrological knowledge grows, you will never grow tired of looking at your own chart, but then will become curious about other people and want to look at their charts as well!

[woodencat]

I wondered if anyone is familiar with the "40 week" rising sign trick? A friend of mine has read a book called "Rising signs" by Sasha Fenton - and she said that Sasha tells of a 'trick' to finding a rising sign without knowing the birthTIME.
she states:
"Count back 40 weeks from the birthdate, then check the moon table and see where the moon is on that particular date - the position of the moon on that date, should show either the descendant or ascent"

OK..now myself not being an expert..lol..I've made a few charts, but I really don't understand HOW this theory can even work...I've tried it out - but it contradicts it self - as anyone born on the same date - would have the same ascendant or descendant...make any sense??..LOL
I haven't read the book...Has anyone, or does anyone know of this theory??
Thanks.. :)

[woodencat]

me again..hehe
Sorry I joined in a little late..and I hope this hasn't already been discussed..sorry if it has. :)

I'm confused about the House systems used, as I said..I've only made a few charts...and wondered about the different House systems used like Equal, Placidus, Vehlow..etc. In most of the books I have, they work only with the Equal house system method, but I was looking on the internet at different Astro sites..like www.astro.com and a lot of them use the Placidus method. What are the major differences/qualities that these methods might bring?

thanks

[Selenia]

The Wheel of Houses:

The chart wheel or mandala of 12 houses can be seen as a circle, or cycle, with each house leading to the next house, and so on, in a counterclockwise direction.
There are also several differing house systems such as Placidus, Regiomontanus, Equal, Vehlow, etc. Most of these differ only in the method of calculation used to divide the quadrants. Also, the transition from one house to another is not as clear as the change from one sign to another. Planets occupying a position near the end of a house are often interpreted as belonging to the next.

There are three different "types" of House system: Time, Space, Quadrant and Equal Houses. The main observable difference between the House Systems are where the intermediate Houses begin and end. The majority of the Time and Quadrant systems will agree on the placement of the Ascendant/Descendant axis (1st/7th House) and the Midheaven/IC axis (10th/4th House). What they don't agree on, however, is how to divide up the quadrants to determine the other eight House cusps.



Quadrant Systems basically divide the chart into four quadrants using the Ascendant and MC Axis, and then use different methods of calculating the intermediate cusps.



CAMPANUS: The prime vertical is divided into twelve equal arcs by lunes (sections of the sphere) whose poles are the north and south points of the horizon. Where the lunes cut the ecliptic are the house cusps.
Named after Johannes Campanus. The houses are derived from the trisection of the quadrants formed by the intersection of the horizon and the meridian with the prime vertical. The prime vertical is divided into twelve equal arcs by lunes (sections of the sphere) whose poles are the north and south points of the horizon. The points where the lines cross the ecliptic define the house cusps.
The arcs comprising the lunes are house semi-circles. The Campanus house system was preferred by Cyril Fagan, Roy Firebrace, Donald Bradley (Garth Allen), Dane Rudhyar, Gary Duncan, and Charles Jayne because of its "clean" geometric definition of the construction of the houses.
In their writings Max Heindel and Augusta Foss Heindel clearly describe the Campanus house system. This system is also preferred by advocates of the sidereal zodiac, a fact that has led some readers, incorrectly, to regard it as an exclusively sidereal tool.


REGIOMONTANUS: The celestial equator is divided into twelve equal segments, beginning at the East Point. The house cusps are formed by the intersections of the house semi-circles with the ecliptic. Since the equator is not perpendicular to the north point-south point axis of the horizon, the houses are not equal.



Time Systems take the semi-arc of some major mundane sensitive point and trisect it, and that trisection becomes the basis for the house divisions.


PLACIDUS: The house cusp curves are formed by points, each of which trisects its own diurnal or nocturnal semi-arc. Where these complex curves cross the ecliptic cusps determine the ecliptic cusps given in the Placidian Tables of Houses.
The Placidus house system is long known in the English-speaking world due to the availability (since the middle of the 19th century) of Raphael's Ephemeris and Raphael's Tables of Houses. There is much argument as to the origin of this system, although it seems generally agreed that it was not the work of the monk Placidus. It appears to have evolved from the Albategnius house system.
The house cusps are formed by points, each of which trisects its own diurnal or nocturnal semi- arc. The points where these complex curves cross the ecliptic are the cusps given in the Placidian Tables of Houses.


KOCH: The diurnal semi-arc of the MC is trisected. Calling the trisections of the semi arc X, the MC is then rotated backwards through its diurnal semi arc. At this point, the MC comes to the horizon. Then the MC is rotated X degrees off the horizon. The new Ascendant is the 11th House cusp. Rotating the MC another X degrees brings the 12th House cusp to the Ascendant, another X degrees brings the 1st House cusp (the final Ascendant) to the Ascendant, another X degrees brings the 2nd House cusp to the Ascendant and finally, another X degrees brings the 3rd House cusp to the Ascendant.
The Koch house system, also known as the Birthplace system, is a time-based system that is similar to the Placidus house system. Tables for this system first appeared in 1971 in an English translation of the work of Walter Koch.
In this system the house cusps are calculated through the division of arcs and their projection onto the ecliptic as follows: For cusps above the horizon: the semi-nocturnal arc (along a small circle) of the rising degree (ascendant) is trisected; then, altitude circles (small circles parallel to the horizon) are constructed through the points of trisection; finally, the cusps are determined by the intersections of these altitude circles with the ecliptic.
For cusps below the horizon: the semi-nocturnal arc is used. The MC and ascendant are the same respectively, as the cusps of the 10th and 1st houses. This system is ill-defined at extreme latitudes.



Space Systems:


MERIDIAN (Equatorial Houses): The celestial equator is divided into twelve equal arcs by lunes from the poles of the celestial equator. The intersections of lunes with the ecliptic are considered the house cusps. Each house is exactly two sidereal hours long. The MC is the cusp of the 10th house and the Equatorial Ascendant is the cusp of the 1st House.
The Meridian house system was proposed by the Australian astrologer Zariel (David Cope) in the early 1900s. It has never received much attention, but was investigated by American astrologers Bruce Lloyd and Garth Allen in the late 1950s.
This system is also referred to as the "Axial-Rotation System" (a misleading term, as no rotation is involved), the "Zariel house system," and the "Equatorial house system." It is the chosen method in the Uranian system of astrology.
In the Meridian house system, the eleventh cusp is what the midheaven would be exactly two hours later in sidereal time, the twelfth cusps four sidereal hours later, the first cusp (equatorial ascendant) six sidereal hours later, and so on around the chart. Equal midheaven houses on the equator are projected (via meridians of right ascension) to the ecliptic. Each house is exactly two sidereal hours long.
The MC is the cusp of the tenth house and the Equatorial Ascendant is the cusp of the first house (the latter is a point often inserted as "Eq." in charts that have not been calculated with Meridian houses).


The Time and Quadrant systems are "unequal" House systems, and in addition to questions of where the intermediate Houses begin and end, they also introduce the possibility of intercepted Signs - Houses that are greater than 30 degrees in arc, and which "contain" an entire Sign (i.e., the cusp of the 5th House is 27 Aries; the cusp of the 6th House is 6 Gemini; the entire Sign of Taurus is contained in the 5th House, and the entire Sign of Scorpio is contained in the 11th House).

Just in case you skipped over the middle section, there is one peculiar fact about the Meridian system that you should be aware of: the 1st House cusp in the Meridian chart that you received is NOT your Ascendant (unless you were born at the Equator, that is). What it represents is the Equatorial Ascendant, which is a different angle, but which basically is what your Ascendant would be if you had been born at the Equator. Your actual Ascendant will be somewhere in either the 12th House or the 1st House in this chart.

Johannes Vehlow was the propagator of the Equal House system. The Equal House systems (another type of Space system, and yes, there are several types) are the easiest to understand: each of the Houses takes up 30 degrees of arc: no messy calculations and divisions are needed for the intermediate House cusps, and they neatly avoid the issue of how to interpret intercepted Signs because there can be no interceptions in Equal House systems. The Equal House systems all agree on where the Ascendant and Midheaven are placed. However, in the Equal House systems, the Ascendant and Midheaven are not necessarily House cusps.

There are three main types of Equal House system:

a) Ascendant based: the Ascendant is the cusp of the 1st House; all other House cusps are spaced 30 degrees apart. The Midheaven is not the cusp of the 10th House, and may not even be IN the 10th House.

b) Midheaven based: The Midheaven is the cusp of the 10th House; all other House cusps are spaced 30 degrees apart. The Ascendant is not the cusp of the 1st House, and may not even be IN the 1st House.

c) Whole Sign Houses: The Houses correspond exactly with the Signs, beginning at 0 degrees of each Sign. The Ascendant and Midheaven are not House cusps, only sensitive points. The 1st House begins with 0 degrees of the Sign of the Ascendant, and the Ascendant may actually be ABOVE the horizon (in the "modern" 12th House).

Which system to use, again, depends on your personal preference, and what you are trying to accomplish with the chart. The two most popular House systems seem to be Koch and Placidus.

Most work with Koch when doing "modern" natal work as it's the most reliable when you need to time events (an astrologer did the research, it involved using several different House systems as applied to the outcome of a great number of horse races, and Koch was the clear winner).

[Litha]

YOW!
uh, I hope Selenia anwered your question, since I definitely don't have any more I could possibly add to the subject!

[woodencat]

Originally posted by Litha
YOW!
uh, I hope Selenia anwered your question, since I definitely don't have any more I could possibly add to the subject!

You sure did Selenia...Thank you kindly :)

I'll have to print that out and Re-read it about 50 times, it turned my eye's a bit squirley..LOL :D
it's alot of information for me at my level of Astrological knowlegde - but I certainly understand now that there is A LOT more to it than i thought.. :D

Thanks again Selenia!