Can a Wiccan be Wiccan without magick?

[MoonKnight]

I'm posting this poll just to see how everyone feels.

Since I posted it I may as well post my opinion. I think yes someone can be a Wiccan and not practice magick. I see Wicca as a spiritual path that embraces magick and not the other way around.

So let me know what you think.

[misschief]

yes. i'm not wiccan.. but .. yes.

[rain_fallen_tears]

Yes, I believe someone can be Wiccan and not take part in rituals or spells...but Wicca to me is a magickal faith in itself, so even if someone doesn't specifically act in magick they are part of it.:)

[violet rain]

I do believe that someone can be wiccan without doing spells but I tend to disagree with the rituals because that is part of being wiccan is to give thanks to the goddess and god sorry I thought I put that in here ooppsss. :ugh:

[Sleet]

Since I posted it I may as well post my opinion. I think yes someone can be a Wiccan and not practice magick.

I wouldn't have thought so - it seems to me, from my study of various pagan paths, that Wicca is inexorably intertwined with its own magical tradition. But others here disagree with that, so it's likely I'm looking at it wrong.

I'm certain, however, that you can call yourself pagan without practicing magic. I do that very thing.

[Theres]

I do believe that someone can be wiccan without doing spells but I tend to disagree with the rituals because that is part of being wiccan is to give thanks to the goddess.
AND the God!

i voted yes, of course. you don't have to practice magick to be Wiccan, but i do think that a belief in magick is beneficial.

[grnpuffer]

It depends on what YOU mean by magic.
There are two orientations: thaumathury and theurgy.
One involves the interaction with the physical world, the other involves interaction with the divine world.
If you study the techniques, they are stongly similar, only the goals are different.

Put another way....
*If you don't believe in magic, why use incense or light candles or wear special robes?
*What's the deepest spiritual meaning of a 'feast' day or a 'celebration'?
*How is it that sacred sites or sacred ground comes into existence? Why are they sacred?
*Read about the lives of the most spiritually advanced people you can- spiritual saints and holy men/women. You'll also read accounts of physical battles with demons, bilocation, spontaneous healings, spontaneous manifestation. Wouldn't you say that the importance of these events is a matter of perspective?
*When you are praying to a diety, what are YOU trying to achieve? a better job? Solving a problem? Enlightenment? Someone else may be trying to achieve the exact same thing but by different means. Does that mean you are being any less magical?

Your perspective is your own.... these ideas are included here just for discussion and inquiry

[Pandoras]

Put another way....
*If you don't believe in magic, why use incense or light candles or wear special robes?
*What's the deepest spiritual meaning of a 'feast' day or a 'celebration'?
*How is it that sacred sites or sacred ground comes into existence? Why are they sacred?
*When you are praying to a diety, what are YOU trying to achieve? a better job? Solving a problem? Enlightenment? Someone else may be trying to achieve the exact same thing but by different means. Does that mean you are being any less magical?

I agree.

I don't think that when Gardner conceived Wicca, it was meant to be separate from magick and I think the two are intertwined. It's one thing not to specifically perform spells, but is Wicca still Wicca without casting circles, calling quarters, invoking the gods, etc.?

[SylverStar]

Yes I think magick is an intregal part of Wicca. You look at dedication rituals, intiation rituals, ritual work and I would think spell work would be a major part of that. At least from all my studies. But I'm not Wiccan so I wouldn't really no from that perspective...just my own.

[Fideal]

It depends on how you define magic. You can Wiccan without performing spells on yourself and people out side of ritual framework, but I don't think you can be Wiccan if you can't use magic to reach the divine, cast circles, perform ritual.

[Ben Gruagach]

I think it is definitely possible to practice Wicca without having magick, but I wonder why bother. Gerald Gardner presented Wicca as THE religion of witchcraft (which is of course questioned today... his form of witchcraft is not the only one after all). Practicing a no-witchcraft Wicca to me misses a large part of the point of Wicca.

But people could still certainly do it. I just don't think they're getting the main benefits of Wicca by ignoring the magick part.

[Gede]

MM~
I didn't vote either option because I do not view Magick as a form, entity or method; in my opinion that alienates us from the truth of the matter, the quintessence of the very energy we are evaluating. Magick, in my opinion, is the life-force; the chi, prana, ether and essence. It is the underlying principle that animates all things and draws from the essential core of all things. As I see it Wicca is a religion that embraces that Life-force in the personification of God and Goddess and therefore it is Magickal in and of itself. Spells and Rituals are expressions of that Magickal understanding, however as we grow and progress spiritually there may be no more need for such things. Spontaneity and inspiration become much more valuable. So yes, I believe that someone can be Wiccan without casting Spells or practicing Rituals, but no I do not believe you can be a Wiccan without Magick.

Namaste, Gede...

[WhiteRavenBran]

Yes, you can be wiccan without performing magic, but I think we all do little magics all the time without realizing it...not all magic is spell work...

[lightdragon]

Yes, you can be wiccan without performing magic, but I think we all do little magics all the time without realizing it...not all magic is spell work...
Whether you realize it or not WRB you just said no. :hmmmmm:

[Lunacie]

I say yes, you can, but why would you want to?

Children know all about magic but as they get older they are taught to deny it. That's like denying that you can see colors, or only eating oatmeal and never knowing how many wonderous tastes there are in the world.

[Calen]

Hmm. IMO, that depends on whether you just choose not to practice magic for whatever reason, or if you don't believe it exists. If you choose not to practice magic yourself for whatever reason, you could probably still be Wiccan (at least in your way of thinking, if not your practices, as far as 'orthodox' Wicca goes) but if you deny it's very existance, I think for you to be Wiccan might be a contradiction of terms.

[MoonKnight]

For the record I practice magick. (Not that anyone thinks otherwise.)

I posted the poll out of curiosity.

[CleftOfLight]

Wicca-is someone who follows the wiccan religion,which is less magickial and more ritual.

Witch-is someone who practices magick,but it doesnt mean religion.

So you can be a wiccan and not use magick,just like you can be a witch and not be wiccan.

[HorseCrow]

I say yes, you can be wiccan without practicing magick. I really feel more inclined to link magick with witch, than with wiccan... like Cleft said.

[Nephthys]

I think you can. Being a Wiccan doesn't nececarrily mean you have to practice magick. I look at Wicca as being more the actual belief. I do think though that if you are a Wiccan you do have to believe in magick, but you don't have to practice it.

[lightdragon]

.

Witch-is someone who practices magick,but it doesnt mean religion.


Just for curiousity. what is the difference between a witch and a magician? If you use this definition of a witch.

[Pandoras]

Wicca-is someone who follows the wiccan religion,which is less magickial and more ritual.

Witch-is someone who practices magick,but it doesnt mean religion.

So you can be a wiccan and not use magick,just like you can be a witch and not be wiccan.

I disagree almost entirely.

Witchcraft doesn't have to be religious, but we're talking about Wicca, a religion that is and was founded to be magickal, strongly influenced by ceremonial magic. Magic is an fundamental part of Wicca. Wiccan rituals - such as casting circles, invoking gods, calling quarters, working with elements, - are magickal. If you are a Wiccan and you are not practicing these rituals, what exactly makes you Wiccan versus another kind of Pagan? Is it because you hold the beliefs that Wiccans do? Do you think of yourself as non-practicing Wiccan?


Originally Posted by lightdragon
Just for curiousity. what is the difference between a witch and a magician? If you use this definition of a witch.

There isn't a difference, not in the strictect sense of the word, but people do use these tems to make distinctions between low and high magic. Ceremonial Magicians practice high magic, involving lengthy, complex rituals, numerology, astrology, and the study of such texts as the Qabala.

[lightdragon]

There isn't a difference, not in the strictect sense of the word, but people do use these tems to make distinctions between low and high magic. Ceremonial Magicians practice high magic, involving lengthy, complex rituals, numerology, astrology, and the study of such texts as the Qabala.
oh ok. thank you for explaining that :yourock:

[Gede]

MM~

There isn't a difference, not in the strictect sense of the word, but people do use these tems to make distinctions between low and high magic. Ceremonial Magicians practice high magic, involving lengthy, complex rituals, numerology, astrology, and the study of such texts as the Qabala.

Agreed~

Namaste, Gede...

[Ben Trismegistus]

Just for curiousity. what is the difference between a witch and a magician? If you use this definition of a witch.
Well, a witch is a KIND of magician, just like a Wiccan is a KIND of pagan. A better definition is that a witch is someone who practices a certain kind of magic (that is to say, witchcraft).

[Ben Gruagach]

I personally tend to think of witch and magician as being two ends of a spectrum. Witches are more of the folk-magick and spontaneous "do magick to get things done" types. Magicians are more prone towards complex and lengthy ceremonial workings based on sophisticated theories of magick usually explained in the various grimoires available like the Key of Solomon.

As actual people who practice magick, we might find that at different times we are tending more towards the witch end of the spectrum or the magician end of the spectrum. Some people do stick more to one end of the spectrum than the other but it's really just a personal preference based on what the individual feels drawn to and what they find works for them. And there's nothing wrong with being in the middle or moving back and forth between the two either.

[Edited to correct a typo.]

[lightdragon]

thank you for the explanation guys. That question always bugged me.

Because i kept hearing one side saying witch and wicca is the same and another side saying some wiccans are witches but not all witches are wiccan.So i'm saying what's the difference between a witch and magician.

[The High Queen of Faerie]

of bloody course so. :)

[Ron]

I don't know about a "Wiccan" whatever that is :rolleyes: but a Wicca could most certainly - although it would be against the divine grace of the gift of the melding of power, unless one embraced solely the will of Overgod.

[The High Queen of Faerie]

I don't know about a "Wiccan" whatever that is :rolleyes: but a Wicca could most certainly - although it would be against the divine grace of the gift of the melding of power, unless one embraced solely the will of Overgod.
uhm, the term 'wiccan' is one commonly used to describe one who has embraced the wiccan faith.

it would be against the divine grace of the gift of the melding of power? some people just don't feel a need for magick, and i personally don't feel as though there's anything wrong with that. some people are merely satisfied with the whole 'spiritual' side of wicca, and don't care for energy working.

it depends on the person.

[Toby Stimpson]

Exactly...magickal usage is like choosing whether or not your going to build a model. If you don't like building models, you dont...if you do, you try to do it to the best of your ability. If your interested in models, but dont choose to build...again, you try to learn all you can about it...but just dont build them.

Although some have said that magick is a high form of worshipping the gods...quiet devotions and meditations can be quite uplifting as well. 'Overgod' as you call it Rhys does not give us the use of magick...neither does it become offended if we choose not to practice...or if we do. It just is. Magick is like science, Gods don't become offended if you learn and practice scientific medicine becasue it's not a gift...uit's just the way of the universe. Namaste.

[The High Queen of Faerie]

Exactly...magickal usage is like choosing whether or not your going to build a model. If you don't like building models, you dont...if you do, you try to do it to the best of your ability. If your interested in models, but dont choose to build...again, you try to learn all you can about it...but just dont build them.

Although some have said that magick is a high form of worshipping the gods...quiet devotions and meditations can be quite uplifting as well. 'Overgod' as you call it Rhys does not give us the use of magick...neither does it become offended if we choose not to practice...or if we do. It just is. Magick is like science, Gods don't become offended if you learn and practice scientific medicine becasue it's not a gift...uit's just the way of the universe. Namaste.

i agree, really. :)

[WhiteRavenBran]

Whether you realize it or not WRB you just said no. :hmmmmm:


lol, I believe you're right!

I think what I meant was that you can be wiccan without doing traditional types of magic (spellwork, etc), but that we all do little types of magic without realizing it? The answer is still no then, I guess...eh, I don't know!

[LadyTrinity]

its about religion ,. not spells :rubhead:

[Lunacie]

its about religion ,. not spells :rubhead:
Again, as I've said before on other threads, spells are not the only way of using magic.

[Pandoras]

I don't know about a "Wiccan" whatever that is :rolleyes: but a Wicca could most certainly - although it would be against the divine grace of the gift of the melding of power, unless one embraced solely the will of Overgod.


Ok, I must be a FluffBunny despite my 10 years as a Pagan Witch, because I don't know what the heck you're talking about.

[The High Queen of Faerie]

Ok, I must be a FluffBunny despite my 10 years as a Pagan Witch, because I don't know what the heck you're talking about.
:lol: i second that... but i'll have to lower my count to 5 years.

[Ron]

Exactly...magickal usage is like choosing whether or not your going to build a model. If you don't like building models, you dont...if you do, you try to do it to the best of your ability. If your interested in models, but dont choose to build...again, you try to learn all you can about it...but just dont build them.

Although some have said that magick is a high form of worshipping the gods...quiet devotions and meditations can be quite uplifting as well. 'Overgod' as you call it Rhys does not give us the use of magick...neither does it become offended if we choose not to practice...or if we do. It just is. Magick is like science, Gods don't become offended if you learn and practice scientific medicine becasue it's not a gift...uit's just the way of the universe. Namaste.

Yes, Tobias, I agree. Even if it might seem I am contradicting myself, I'm really not.

[Toby Stimpson]

hehehe, thats ok...oh! ohohohoh...overgod translation (Goddess...Allah, God, Brahma,....chief of Chief, lords of lords,highmother...etc.,)

[Ron]

hehehe, thats ok...oh! ohohohoh...overgod translation (Goddess...Allah, God, Brahma,....chief of Chief, lords of lords,highmother...etc.,)
yeahhhhhhhhh glad you understand ... and I didn't have to explain

[Kendrah]

I know I'm the odd duck out here but...

No, you can't be Wiccan if you don't practice magic. Magic is more then casting spells. In fact, casting spells is rare. All the candles, all that insence is all secondary. When you walk the world alive, you practice "magic" with every breath you take. You effect change, you're the one in control of your world. You are magic, change. As the saying goes, you should be able to "do magic" mute, bound, and blind-folded. And maybe held underwater.

The point is that it is you. You don't do magic. It's just a side effect of your being.

Yes, you can believe in the God and the Goddess. You can go through the motions and celebrate the full moons and changing seasons. That's fine. But that's spirituality. Not wicca...

[Rubber_Piggy]

I do believe that someone can be wiccan without doing spells but I tend to disagree with the rituals because that is part of being wiccan is to give thanks to the goddess and god sorry I thought I put that in here ooppsss. :ugh:

I agree with violet rain. You can be wiccan without casting spells, however rituals are a nessasary part. However I also think that as you prgress along the path you will naturally priactice rituals anyway. I do think though that you must have a belief in magic/energy.

[goDez]

I know I'm the odd duck out here but...

No, you can't be Wiccan if you don't practice magic. Magic is more then casting spells. In fact, casting spells is rare. All the candles, all that insence is all secondary. When you walk the world alive, you practice "magic" with every breath you take. You effect change, you're the one in control of your world. You are magic, change. As the saying goes, you should be able to "do magic" mute, bound, and blind-folded. And maybe held underwater.

The point is that it is you. You don't do magic. It's just a side effect of your being.

Yes, you can believe in the God and the Goddess. You can go through the motions and celebrate the full moons and changing seasons. That's fine. But that's spirituality. Not wicca...

Interesting view there! Well, I think you are right actually. I voted yes before.. But then again; we have to look towards the context in which the question is placed, and I think the topic starter meant magick as in spellworking, any kind of magic that involves "WORKING" magic (in a witchy way, lol). Then, my answer would be yes, since I believe you don't have to be all witchy to be a Wiccan.

But if we would look at it the way you are, you are so right. All Wiccans are (or should be) aware of what magic is and how it influences everyone's daily life. Which means that if you are a Wiccan, and understand the principles of magic, you should have developed some kind of philosophy about how magic works for the personal self (which is something every Wiccan should do in my opinion (thinking about life, "ethic of constant improvement", the latter is perhaps Universal Eclectic Wicca (which I do not follow), but nonetheless I think it's a valuable point of ethics).

[Silverfangs]

In my opinion a Wiccan as to do some sort of magical practice\rituals to be Wiccan. I think the essence of a Wiccan practioner is to comune with the gods and divinities using rituals and magic.

If a Wiccan is "away" from the practical part of the Wicca, is not a Wiccan in 100%.

When I talk about practicing magic I dont refer to complex and huge things, because today, most of the people can't realize or have dificult to realize such acts - familiar enviorment, social enviorment, etc... But at least some "symbolic" practices...

Well.. but thats my opinion.. :thumbsup:

[Writer_Waif]

IMO

Magick is part of Wicca, not the other way around.
You can be Wicca without the Magick.

[Joshua]

You can be Wicca without the Magick.
That's true, but the opposite is true as well. I, for example, am a witch but I am not wiccan.

[Writer_Waif]

That's true, but the opposite is true as well. I, for example, am a witch but I am not wiccan.

That is true,
I don't consider myself a witch or wiccan.
I do use magick in some of my practices but not everything is magick oriented.

[magick_faerie]

i am wiccan but dont do Magick unless the situation really calls for it, i trust in my inner magick and use my thoughts and wishes to do Magick, i often like candles and say quick blessings which i have found to be as powerful as big elborate rituals. But for sabbats and specific magickal workings, i will cast a circle and p[erform a ritual, i think that if you practise magick you pratice it with everything you do, the difference is knowing that you are creating change with the aid of the Goddess, that is what makes me a witch.

but i may be wrong, its just what works for me, but i have never tried anything else so who am i to comment?

blessings

fae

[XxAuroraxX]

yes i'm wiccan but i do not practice magick.

[Kadynas]

I voted yes... I do rituals for holidays and such, but not much "magic" or spells geared towards a particualr purpose. I guess one could argue that casting the circle and communing with the gods is a magic unto itself, but that's the distinction I make. :)

[Crystal_Raye]

Its kinda hard to not practice magick when its all around you. In the air you breathe, the food you eat, and the world you live in.

[AlphaOmega]

anybody can be wiccan...and that doesn't mean that they have to take participate in rituals and stuff..

[Kendrah]

anybody can be wiccan...and that doesn't mean that they have to take participate in rituals and stuff..

That's like saying anyone can know japanese, but that doesn't mean they have to speak and understand the language.

[Kaylana]

I consider myself Wiccan because I celebrate the wiccan sabbats. Its possible to celebrate without magick. I think practicing magick and religion are to seperate issues though they can and are put together.

[Ice Rose]

i tihnk a Wiccan can be Wicca and not practice magick, cause Wicca is a way of life, and magick is only a small part of what you can do, it's not what you have to do. i'm wiccan and i dont practice magick that much anyway... so i have this view like i stated above:cutie:

[WingedTigerChild]

I've got a question...

For those of you who happen to be Wiccan and practice little to no magic(k) at all, what exactly makes you a Wiccan? Like, what do you believe constitutes you as a Wiccan? Is Wicca merely believing in a God-Goddess duality?...I'm just curious...

[-Ember]

I don't believe you can be a Wiccan and not practice magic. As someone pointed out, it is a way of life and a way of being. Part of that is the use of magic as an option and its effects on your life in defining how one relates to the world. It is part of the perspective that makes one wiccan rather than something else. To not work magic is to not live the faith because magic is part of it. You might still be neopagan if you don't, but I wouldn't consider you to be a Wiccan. You are just missing too much of the lifestyle.

[Lunacie]

You can read hundreds of gourmet cook books and buy fancy kitchen tools, but if you only eat fast food can you really call yourself a gourmet? :huh:


You can read Wicca books and visit Wicca websites and buy an athame and a chalice, but if you only read about it and talk about it, can you really call yourself a Wiccan? :whatgives


I know that some will still call themselves Wiccan even though they only have the Beliefs and not the Practices, but they shouldn't be suprised when they don't get the same respect as someone who commits to the whole Wiccan experience.

[tarotbaby]

You can read hundreds of gourmet cook books and buy fancy kitchen tools, but if you only eat fast food can you really call yourself a gourmet? :huh:

That's a bit different. By a long shot.



You can read Wicca books and visit Wicca websites and buy an athame and a chalice, but if you only read about it and talk about it, can you really call yourself a Wiccan? :whatgives

Well, given that Wicca is a revival of various pagan religions stamped out by Xianity, I know that there is no set "practice" of it. So, I'd say that so long as one has faith in Wicca, then yes they are Wiccan. If they are just reading, but lack faith, then no. If they saw it on Buffy or Charmed, and that is what they are basing it all off of, eh... They need to re-evaluate.



I know that some will still call themselves Wiccan even though they only have the Beliefs and not the Practices, but they shouldn't be suprised when they don't get the same respect as someone who commits to the whole Wiccan experience.

I considered myself Wiccan for 13 years (was strongly drawn to it at the age of 11), but I finally distanced myself from it because of all the wanna-be's and posers flooding in and trying to set a litmus test on who is or isn't a true Wiccan. I used to argue with them just as much as I'd argue with a Xian who felt it was their destiny to argue with me and try to change me. There is no "one true path". Wicca started going downhill the moment the moment they started emulating Xians by passing judgment on who was or wasn't a TRUE Wiccan. Wicca started going downhill the moment they forgot their roots, they forgot they are also neopagans, trying to rebuild a lost faith that there is now no set way to follow. The moment they started putting a "K" on the end of the word "magic". It kills me, because I loved Wicca, but because I believed differently and practiced differently than most of the ones I knew and met, I was harassed into just saying "To hell with religion of any kind!" I love nature, I love the earth... I loved the spirituality that Wicca gave me without the silly scriptures and the set in stone rules of other religions. Wicca is very changed from what it was, and it makes me sad... :-(

For proper information on the history of Wicca:
http://www.religioustolerance.org/wic_hist.htm
Witch Vox is a very informative site, and they wrote a piece on magic and the myths surrounding it:
http://www.witchvox.com/words/words_1997/e_spellthat.html

[Lunacie]

I would agree with everything you're saying ~ if you were saying it about Paganism. Wicca doesn't have any "one true practice" but it does have a core set of beliefs set out by Gerald Gardner. There are certainly some variations, but I think most Wiccans can recognize those core things.


We all judge each other, that's a very human thing to do, not something I would blame Christians for inventing.

[Pandoras]

I agree with Lunacie.

Witchcraft doesn't have to be religious, but we're talking about Wicca, a religion that is and was founded to be magical, strongly influenced by ceremonial magic. Magic is an fundamental part of Wicca. It's one thing not to cast spells, but Wiccan rituals - such as casting circles, invoking gods, calling quarters, working with elements, - are magickal. If you are a Wiccan and you are not practicing these rituals, what exactly makes you Wiccan versus another kind of Pagan?

[MorningDove030202]

I agree with Lunacie.

Witchcraft doesn't have to be religious, but we're talking about Wicca, a religion that is and was founded to be magical, strongly influenced by ceremonial magic. Magic is an fundamental part of Wicca. It's one thing not to cast spells, but Wiccan rituals - such as casting circles, invoking gods, calling quarters, working with elements, - are magickal. If you are a Wiccan and you are not practicing these rituals, what exactly makes you Wiccan versus another kind of Pagan?


I agree! When I hear that people are interested in Wicca, except the magick part I think (and I could be wrong) people are attracted to the earth based aspects of Wicca, and perhapse the Goddess worshiping aspects. But you can practice an earth based Goddess spirituality without being magickal or even pagan. I have friends who just worship "The Goddess" and doesn't pay any attention to mythology or pagan cultures. It's a Goddess monotheism, and they did start out as Wiccan, but eventualy realized they realy wern't. I think some people who are realy into the earth based, eco-spirituality parts are calling themselves Gaiests, and are looking at the Gaia Theory.

Anyone agree or disagree?

Dove

[Lunacie]

Exactly. There's nothing wrong with being something other than Wicca and worshipping the god and goddess together, honoring the earth and the universe, calling the elements, whatever you do. But why call it Wicca when it leaves out half of what Wicca is all about? Just call it Pagan or Gaiest or something more general.

Mind you, I'm not even sure I should call myself Wiccan because of the sporadic nature of my practices, but they are Wiccan practices and beliefs.

[MorningDove030202]

Exactly. There's nothing wrong with being something other than Wicca and worshipping the god and goddess together, honoring the earth and the universe, calling the elements, whatever you do. But why call it Wicca when it leaves out half of what Wicca is all about? Just call it Pagan or Gaiest or something more general.

Mind you, I'm not even sure I should call myself Wiccan because of the sporadic nature of my practices, but they are Wiccan practices and beliefs.

If that's what you practice then you are Wiccan, even if you do is sporadicly. I don't think Wicca should be about who does each holiday ever year with out missing one. This year I've only done Summer Solstice, Maybon, and Samhain, but that's no way to measure anyone's faith.

Dove

[tarotbaby]

I agree with Lunacie.

Witchcraft doesn't have to be religious, but we're talking about Wicca, a religion that is and was founded to be magical, strongly influenced by ceremonial magic. Magic is an fundamental part of Wicca. It's one thing not to cast spells, but Wiccan rituals - such as casting circles, invoking gods, calling quarters, working with elements, - are magickal. If you are a Wiccan and you are not practicing these rituals, what exactly makes you Wiccan versus another kind of Pagan?

Check out the links I posted.

Wicca is a nature based religion.

[tarotbaby]

I agree! When I hear that people are interested in Wicca, except the magick part I think (and I could be wrong) people are attracted to the earth based aspects of Wicca, and perhapse the Goddess worshiping aspects. But you can practice an earth based Goddess spirituality without being magickal or even pagan. I have friends who just worship "The Goddess" and doesn't pay any attention to mythology or pagan cultures. It's a Goddess monotheism, and they did start out as Wiccan, but eventualy realized they realy wern't. I think some people who are realy into the earth based, eco-spirituality parts are calling themselves Gaiests, and are looking at the Gaia Theory.

Anyone agree or disagree?

Dove

Check out the links I posted.

Wicca is a revival religion. There are many Wiccan books explaining this if you need to see it in print from a professional standpoint.

Some helpful sites:
http://paganwiccan.about.com/cs/whatiswicca/a/aawhatiswicca.htm
http://www.faqs.org/faqs/religions/wicca/faq/ - One of the best. It corrects one common misinformation: "3.1 Can I be a Christian/ Jew/ Muslim/ Buddhist/ Taoist/ Astrologer/
Druid/ Shaman/ omnivore/ whatever and a Wiccan?

Since much of Wicca is more worldview and ceremonial practice than
anything else, there is no Wiccan proscription of such things. Most
traditions have no requirement to denounce any other faith and, indeed,
Wiccans often look askance at "one true wayisms" which claim to have a
monopoly on truth, divine revelation or enlightenment. "Christian
Wiccans" probably face the largest skepticism, however, given the history
and ongoing reality of allegedly "Christian" persecution. "

But, most importantly: "3.3 Do all Wiccans practice magic/k?

That depends on what one means by magic. The occultist Aleister
Crowley helped re-popularize archaic spellings such as "magick", terming
his "the Science and Art of causing Change to occur in conformity with
Will." Others may think of magic as folk parapsychology or see the
changes wrought as primarily changes in consciousness. Ceremonialists may
distinguish between the "high magick" of ritual observance and the "low
magic" of practical spells (such as for protection and health). Almost
all Wiccans, however, have some sort of ceremony or psychological practice
to better attune themselves with divinity, encouraging insight and a sense
of efficacy. Others may cast love spells or other curses but no, we don't
do it for strangers on the net and no, we don't confuse this with stage
magic. "

http://www.paganpride.org/resources/whatiswicca.html
http://wicca.timerift.net/ - Another really good site. I just found this and will add it to my bookmarks posthaste. The same site goes into an article about the whole spiel about how to be a "real wiccan", one must obey certian rules/commandments.
http://wicca.timerift.net/laws/documents.html

The trick here is that all Wiccans remain open-minded and understanding.

[tarotbaby]

I would agree with everything you're saying ~ if you were saying it about Paganism. Wicca doesn't have any "one true practice" but it does have a core set of beliefs set out by Gerald Gardner. There are certainly some variations, but I think most Wiccans can recognize those core things.


We all judge each other, that's a very human thing to do, not something I would blame Christians for inventing.


For the first part: I just posted some more links, wish I had them when I posted the first. Check them out.

As for the second: LoL, I never said they invented judging. The problem is, they are the worst with it. They may not even believe in all of the religion, and are only using that bible as a crutch for their own insecurities. *shrugs* Who knows... However, I don't like seeing someone who is Wiccan saying someone else isn't Wiccan simply because they aren't dressed up like Hermoine/Harry and dancing around in the backyard. Magic/Spells mean something different to various people, and often things we do which others would call magic, we just call by other more mundane terms.

When I sit and let myself calm, concentrating on letting energy flow out of me, then back into me for whatever reason, I don't call that magic or spellcasting. I call it meditation. I just don't want the dramatics and theater that many have decided to become Wiccan for. Granted some people need the dramatics and theater to be able to concentrate and hone their energies, but then there are those who think it's going to be like it is on Buffy or Charmed...

[Lunacie]

I don't use superficial judgments, but I do think it's perfectly reasonable to assume that any religion will have it's core beliefs and practices that set it apart from other religions. I think it's also reasonable to wonder if someone truly understands Wicca if they say they don't have to do magic to be Wiccan. As you say, we each have our own personal definition of magic, and I don't go in for the dramatics and theater style either. I agree that feeling the energy flow in and out as you describe isn't what I think of as magic. Using that energy to make a change in accord with my will is what I do call magic.

[WhiteRavenBran]

I know I'm the odd duck out here but...

No, you can't be Wiccan if you don't practice magic. Magic is more then casting spells. In fact, casting spells is rare. All the candles, all that insence is all secondary. When you walk the world alive, you practice "magic" with every breath you take. You effect change, you're the one in control of your world. You are magic, change. As the saying goes, you should be able to "do magic" mute, bound, and blind-folded. And maybe held underwater.

The point is that it is you. You don't do magic. It's just a side effect of your being.

Yes, you can believe in the God and the Goddess. You can go through the motions and celebrate the full moons and changing seasons. That's fine. But that's spirituality. Not wicca...

I believe this is what I meant when I first answered the question. Thanks to Kendrah for wording it better!

[AnFoghlaiBanrion]

I agree with Lunacie.

Witchcraft doesn't have to be religious, but we're talking about Wicca, a religion that is and was founded to be magical, strongly influenced by ceremonial magic. Magic is an fundamental part of Wicca. It's one thing not to cast spells, but Wiccan rituals - such as casting circles, invoking gods, calling quarters, working with elements, - are magickal. If you are a Wiccan and you are not practicing these rituals, what exactly makes you Wiccan versus another kind of People?

Hmm. I actually have nothing to add to that. But I completely agree... and I know how much you were all breathlessly awaiting my opinion. :foh:

[Elderbush]

It all really comes down to the definition of magic, doen't it? My dictionary:

1. The art that purports to control or forecast natural events, effects or forces by invoking the supernatural.

I think that a person can be Wiccan and not do that kind of magic.

2. The practice of using charms, spells, or rituals to attempt to produce supernatural effects or to control events of nature.

I think that a person could be Wiccan and not do that kind of magic, too.

3. The exercise of sleight of hand or conjuring for entertainment: etc.

OK, a Wiccan doesn't have to do that kind or magic either.

It goes on. Two people can be using the word in two different ways and argue indefinately. The only way to not misunderstand is if a particular definition of magic is used. Not this is what magic means to me but for the purposes of my question this is how magic is defined.

[MorningDove030202]

And then if you ask "Is Prayer Magick?" it gets even more confusing.

Dove

[Lunacie]

Hmm. I actually have nothing to add to that. But I completely agree... and I know how much you were all breathlessly awaiting my opinion. :foh:*finally breathing again*

:rotfl:

[Ivy Artemisia]

Yup, I see Wicca as a religion with a belief system, and magick as a practice.... I think that if you are Wiccan you can take it or leave it. :)

[moliver]

Ok, I must be a FluffBunny despite my 10 years as a Pagan Witch, because I don't know what the heck you're talking about.

I think that the previous poster was referring to the fact that the word "Wiccan" is an "Americanism". Correct spelling would be Wicca or Wica as per the origional language and use of the word. When referring to a practitioner, it would be propper to say "of the Wicca" or simply a Wicca.

This goes hand in hand with the propper pronunciation of the word. It is correctly pronounced sounding like "witcha". Wicca and witch - the research being done now shows that they meant the same thing. Wiccan sounds as strange to me as Witchian.

I do fall in to the same trap though, because I get tired of explaining to people why I pronounce it the way I do.

--
Mike Oliver

[Lunacie]

Yup, I see Wicca as a religion with a belief system, and magick as a practice.... I think that if you are Wiccan you can take it or leave it. :)
Religions consist of both core beliefs and practices. One of the Christian practices is taking communion, can you be a Christian and not take communion? One of the core practices of Catholicism is attending mass, can you be a Catholic and not attend mass? One of the core practices of Buddhism is meditation, can you be a Buddhist and not meditate? One of the core practices of Wicca is doing magic, can you be a Wiccan and not do magic?

My answer to each question is 'no.' But I understand that not everyone agrees with me.

[Ivy Artemisia]

Religions consist of both core beliefs and practices. One of the Christian practices is taking communion, can you be a Christian and not take communion? One of the core practices of Catholicism is attending mass, can you be a Catholic and not attend mass? One of the core practices of Buddhism is meditation, can you be a Buddhist and not meditate? One of the core practices of Wicca is doing magic, can you be a Wiccan and not do magic?

My answer to each question is 'no.' But I understand that not everyone agrees with me.

I hear what you are saying- but I don't feel as though you HAVE to do the practice of magick to be Wiccan. I feel that some of the core practices of being Wiccan is the casting a circle, calling quarters, etc. I don't feel as though you must practice magick to be Wiccan.

But, like you... not everyone agrees with me. ;)

[moliver]

I hear what you are saying- but I don't feel as though you HAVE to do the practice of magick to be Wiccan. I feel that some of the core practices of being Wiccan is the casting a circle, calling quarters, etc. I don't feel as though you must practice magick to be Wiccan.

But, like you... not everyone agrees with me. ;)

Casting a circle and calling quarters are acts of magic. Wicca rituals use magic in their very structure (erecting the temple, calling the quaters, invoking the gods, etc). As Wicca is a religion of practice and not simply belief, then you are not of the Wicca (at least not a practicing one) if you do not partake in these rituals. So, obsiously, I am a nay vote. :)

--
Mike Oliver

[Lunacie]

I hear what you are saying- but I don't feel as though you HAVE to do the practice of magick to be Wiccan. I feel that some of the core practices of being Wiccan is the casting a circle, calling quarters, etc. I don't feel as though you must practice magick to be Wiccan.

But, like you... not everyone agrees with me. ;)

Are you just making some motions when you cast a circle?

Or are you drawing on energy/magic to create a sacred space that's separate from the mundane world?

[Ben Gruagach]

I think that the previous poster was referring to the fact that the word "Wiccan" is an "Americanism". Correct spelling would be Wicca or Wica as per the origional language and use of the word. When referring to a practitioner, it would be propper to say "of the Wicca" or simply a Wicca.

This goes hand in hand with the propper pronunciation of the word. It is correctly pronounced sounding like "witcha". Wicca and witch - the research being done now shows that they meant the same thing. Wiccan sounds as strange to me as Witchian.

I do fall in to the same trap though, because I get tired of explaining to people why I pronounce it the way I do.

--
Mike Oliver

These arguments have been raised before. Unfortunately for language purists, the common usage is now very entrenched and is unlikely to be "corrected" back to the originals.

Blame it on Gerald Gardner if you like. He's probably the first one to have used the word wicca (spelled as wica) to refer to the religion rather than in its original meaning as merely "male witch." The way Gardner used the word, and others copied after him, it implied the word Wica referred to the religion.

Just as a recap on the etymology for people who might be interested in it, the original words and definitions were as follows:

wicca - (pronounced "witch-a") a male practioner of witchcraft
wicce - (pronounced "witch" or "witch-eh") a female practitioner of witchcraft
wiccian - to cast a spell

Today, of course, Wicca (pronounced "wick-ah") refers to a specific religion, and a member of that religion regardless of gender is a Wiccan.

There are some of the etymological roots explained at http://www.sacred-texts.com/bos/bos093.htm

[Fang of Loki]

I voted "Yes".

[kissesree]

yes, if they choose to not work with magic, they can do other things.

[Lunacie]

yes, if they choose to not work with magic, they can do other things.
And what 'other things' do you think a Wiccan could do instead of magic?

[Elderbush]

It truly depends on the definition of magic.

[Hope3645]

I don't think one can be a Traditional Wiccan without practicing magick. I think to be Wiccan at all you must practice higher magick- purposeful spiritual growth. This is what makes Wicca different from some other religions. It is a belief system, a state of being, and a practice. I am Wiccan. This is my personal take on the situation, but it is based on what I have read in various books on Wicca. Personally, I am not that concerned with religious labels. Who cares what others call you. Just follow your heart and you will end up where you need to be.

[Elderbush]

Now that is a non-traditional definition for magic that I've never heard before. Could you cite the source for that defintion for magic, please?

[MorningDove030202]

I don't know if this counts for a "source" per se.... but I did have a clergy member of the Assembly of the Sacred Wheel (an ecletice Wiccan Tradition with a number of covens www.sacredwheel.org) tell me that groups (covens) will fail if spirital growth is not their main focus.

Dove

[Elderbush]

Constant spiritual growth of the individual is mandated by the tradition I belong to as well. It is just that I never heard that described as magic. I think that it would be interesting to gather together all these non-traditional definitions of magic. I'm not sure what it says about either the word or our community.

[Hope3645]

*"Now that is a non-traditional definition for magic that I've never heard before. Could you cite the source for that defintion for magic, please?"*

My source for my defitition of magick is taken from the book True Magick by Amber K (High Priestess and Elder of the Temple of the Pagan way). It is a great book, and was my first magical book. In chapter one, About Magick and You, she explores various definitions of magick from various occultists.


"Magic is the science of the control of the secret forces of nature."
-S.L. MacGregor Mathers, Order of the Golden Dawn

"Magic is a comprehensive knowledge of all nature."
-Francis Barrett

"Magic is the art and science of effecting changes in consciousness ay will."
-William Butler

"The work of magic involves transformation, and the first transformation is the shift of the perception."
-Marion Weinstein

"The stage-by-stage development of the entire human being is the whole aim of magic."
-Stewart Farrar

"Magic can help you get your entire life in harmony-mentally, emotionaly, physically, spiritualy, and psychically...And what is the ultimate purpose of the work? To fulfill the self on a even higher level. To transform, uplift, and so fully develop the self that the whole Universe may benefit thereby."
-Weinstein

"Magic is for growing up Children of Light. Sane, sound, healthy, and happy souls, living naturally and normally on levels of inner life where we can be REAL people as contrasted with the poor shadow-selves we project at one another on Earth."
William G. Gray

"Because we give up our old selves, any change is a little death. To choose this, to will it, and seek it out is an act of incredible courage. Magick requires daring. It brings the little death which is part of rebirth."
-Amber k

At the end of this chapter she says that theugy or P.E.T. (as defined by Bonewits) is "the use of magic for religious and/or psychotherapeutic purposes, in order to attain 'salvation' or 'personal evolution'". She says that this is usually the best and highest form of magick (I have hear it called higher magick somewhere else too, but would have to dig through many books to find out where). Thaumaturgy is "the use of magic for nonreligious purposes".
Since Wicca is a religion, it requires this "higher magick" as do (in theory) all religions.

[Luciferish]

Magic or Magick or Majik or however you people are spelling it this week is a basic fact of life in the old religions. If a person aspires to a spiritual path to the core of their being they cannot help but be invloved in Self Transformation. This concept implies "Magic" in the sense that Magic is Transformation, Transformation is Magic.

Many people cross the idea of Magic with the act of Spellcrafting. Any person who is on a transformative path is in fact working forms of magic. Meditation, self improvment even Worship implies the use of influences outside normal physical deffinition to create change.

If you are Wiccan, Witch or whatever you want to call yourself, you work magic just by existing. You can't stop it, you can't prevent it. The first person that comes to you for advice and you help them even in the slightest you have worked magic.

[Rain Gnosis]

No. If one can't cast a circle, meditate, celebrate Sabbats or work with esbats, or see themself as a manifestation of the Divine - all of which involve magic - I wouldn't call them Wiccan.

[MorningDove030202]

Weither other religions recognize it or not, they all involve energy (aka magick) so I would say to practice any religion you have to practice magick. It doens't have to be Wiccan flavored, but its still there.

Dove

[Luciferish]

I would be inclined to agree with that assessment... With a few exceptions... Those who attend religious services and gain absolutely nothing from it.

[MorningDove030202]

I would be inclined to agree with that assessment... With a few exceptions... Those who attend religious services and gain absolutely nothing from it.


True, but in that case a person would hardly be a practioner of that religion.

Dove

[farm girl]

It depends what one means by magic. I think one can be Wiccan without spell work.

It really doesn't matter what Gerald Gardner's intentions were with Wicca. All religions have evolved over time in different directions from the founder's intentions. Orthopraxy changes. It is just part of life in the religious and spiritual world.

[Lunacie]

It depends what one means by magic. I think one can be Wiccan without spell work.

It really doesn't matter what Gerald Gardner's intentions were with Wicca. All religions have evolved over time in different directions from the founder's intentions. Orthopraxy changes. It is just part of life in the religious and spiritual world.
Yes, religions evolve and change over time. But if they lose the core beliefs and practices then they aren't the same religion anymore.

[Elderbush]

I don't think that anyone would want to claim that Wicca is the same religion that it was on the day it was created. It has evolved over time, for good or ill, and groups have gone in different directions from each other as well. Some will evolve into something that is quite different from the religion that Gardner envisioned. Groups will rise and fall, ideas come and go. Change is inevitable.

One good thing about Wicca is that it isn't a cult and there is enough diversity, and diversified groups, for it to be possible to find one that suits the traditionalist as well as the non. :)

[farm girl]

Yes, I agree completely. Every religion changes- even down to their core principles. Christianity is a wonderful example of this. If it's core beliefs were still practiced, all Christians would abstain from military service, wear headcoverings, practice forgivenes & compassion, women would be allowed to minister in all branches, Sabbath would be on Saturday, there would be Jewish holidays-not Christmas & Easter, and bible thumpers would definitely not exist. Unfortunately, that religion doesn't exist in that form anymore, but they are still Christian.

[Lunacie]

Yes, I agree completely. Every religion changes- even down to their core principles. Christianity is a wonderful example of this. If it's core beliefs were still practiced, all Christians would abstain from military service, wear headcoverings, practice forgivenes & compassion, women would be allowed to minister in all branches, Sabbath would be on Saturday, there would be Jewish holidays-not Christmas & Easter, and bible thumpers would definitely not exist. Unfortunately, that religion doesn't exist in that form anymore, but they are still Christian.
I believe you are talking about the religion of the Jews, not of the Christians. Jesus was born into a Jewish family, a Jewish culture, with Jewish laws and principles and traditions. Jesus himself only spoke of a couple of laws for his followers, mostly about loving each other. He said that the laws of the old faith weren't important for his followers. The Nicean council may have included the Old Testament in the compilation of their Bible to show the history of the father of Jesus, eh?

[Modesty]

When you see Jews and Catholics that don't attend church or go to mass ( which is their equivalency to a Pagans 'magick') then they have not lost their title as Jew or Christian, they simply are not a practicing Jew or Christian anymore. the same with Paganism and any religion for that matter. I was initiated into the Georgian Tradition, have been with my coven for over 3 years, and recently moved over 2000 miles away and have no coven to practice with. I do not believe I am not a Georgian anymore because I don't have my coven, because they are always going to be there, just a few states over. And I practice by myself until I can come in contact with other Georgians in the near states or until I decide to start my own coven (which is a lot of work).

But on the other side of things, how could a person call themself a Buddhist, when their views are based on that of Satanism. Or a person who calls themself a Wiccan, but goes to a pentecostal church every sunday and praises God Almighty, or a person who calls themself a Christian, but thinks like a Satanist? This is where the 'practice' of it needs to come in for it to be considered "whole" in my opinion. Call youself what you may, but do you really and could you honestly consider what you are calling yourself if your heart isn't completely in it and your thoughts and ideas revolve around something totally different?

To each his own I guess. But I see both sides to this. BB, Mod

[Lunacie]

Ah, that is a very good distinction I think - practicing Wiccans or not practicing Wiccans.

[StarSpiral]

I voted "No" but as others have stated it depends on your definition of magick. Mine includes three factors: (1) willing (2)the movement of energy (3) to create change. This can be a temporay change like casting and releasing a circle, personal change/development, or change created through spell crafting. And a Wiccan must do at least some of these to be seen as a Wiccan to me. I don't think there is a set amount of practice one has to partake in in a certain amount of time to remain Wiccan. A Wiccan might not have cast a a circle or participated in a ritual in years and still be a Wiccan, a rather disconnected Wiccan I'll wager, but a Wiccan none-the-less.


but it does have a core set of beliefs set out by Gerald Gardner. There are certainly some variations, but I think most Wiccans can recognize those core things.
What would you define these core beliefs to be?


And then if you ask "Is Prayer Magick?" it gets even more confusing.
Depends on the type of prayer, but in most cases I see prayer as magic.


Yes, I agree completely. Every religion changes- even down to their core principles. Christianity is a wonderful example of this. If it's core beliefs were still practiced, all Christians would abstain from military service, wear headcoverings, practice forgivenes & compassion, women would be allowed to minister in all branches, Sabbath would be on Saturday, there would be Jewish holidays-not Christmas & Easter, and bible thumpers would definitely not exist. Unfortunately, that religion doesn't exist in that form anymore, but they are still Christian.
I think you're mixing up core principles/beliefs with original practices. The core beliefs of Christianity are a belief in God as Father, Son, Holy Spirit; that God sent Jesus to Earth to redeem humanity from original sin; and in the importance of following Jesus' teachings to lead a good life.


Ah, that is a very good distinction I think - practicing Wiccans or not practicing Wiccans.
Wow, we must be a real religion if we can have non-practicing members! :hehehehe:

[Lunacie]

<snip>
I don't think there is a set amount of practice one has to partake in in a certain amount of time to remain Wiccan. A Wiccan might not have cast a a circle or participated in a ritual in years and still be a Wiccan, a rather disconnected Wiccan I'll wager, but a Wiccan none-the-less.

Originally Posted by Lunacie
but it does have a core set of beliefs set out by Gerald Gardner. There are certainly some variations, but I think most Wiccans can recognize those core things.



What would you define these core beliefs to be? To begin with – I feel initiation is important for belonging to a tradition or a coven, but I believe that one can experience being initiated by the gods and connecting with that energy without belonging to a coven or a tradition. I myself experienced both, and feel that for me the inward initiation had to come before the outward initiation into the coven.

A Wiccan believes that the divine is represented by a male and a female presence, a god and a goddess that balance each other and complete each other, each fulfilling a certain role in the cosmos; embodied by a multitude of individual gods and goddesses.

I call on the quarters/elements for many things, including doing ritual. For me this one is core. For many the use of tools to represent the elements is core. Unless I’m doing a ritual I don’t use any tools except for the tool of my mind and my connection with the elements.

The Reed I do not feel is core, especially when it is misquoted as “Harm None”, which is virtually impossible. The Law of Return or Balance I do believe is core.

The Sabbats I feel are core, and also the Esbats.

Casting a circle is also core, but I will admit that I only do this when performing a group ritual; otherwise I depend on my house wards and personal shielding.

For me, Witchcraft is also core (magic and more).

I understand that for most, the Great Rite is core.

Responsibility for our actions is core in my opinion.

Also personal growth or improvement is core.

[Stormbeard]

Can a Wiccan be Wiccan without magick?

No

You have to be a Christian if you don't do the magick.

[Lunacie]

No

You have to be a Christian if you don't do the magick.
Are you serious?

'Cause yesterday was April Fool's, eh?

[moonlightdancer]

i believe that yes, somone can be Wiccan without physically practicing magick...you dont really need to do magick, to me, wicca is the path that one can choose to help themselves better their own lives...you learn things about yourself, and to me, that's the most important aspect...

[DaNcInG_WiNd]

i believe that yes, somone can be Wiccan without physically practicing magick...you dont really need to do magick, to me, wicca is the path that one can choose to help themselves better their own lives...you learn things about yourself, and to me, that's the most important aspect...

I believe this is true as well. I chose this path to discover who I was and to better my life, and it has improved by leaps and bounds for the most part. I do practice magick once in a while but don't do it religiously. The closest I could describe myself as being is solitary Wiccan practitioner...or something close to that...lol

[Lunacie]

I find it rather interesting that my former metaphysical mentor, a man who has little use for religion or even spirituality, had this to say when asked how he defines "magic". He replied that he sees magic as potential allowing you to be the best person you can be. Something tells me that this may be one of the big reasons that Gerald Gardner included so much magic in the books he wrote, and the teaching he did. Learning to work with the magic (the energy) that is a natural part of the world around us can teach us a lot about ourselves, our connections with other people, and our connection with the gods.

[wyrdmage]

Being Wiccan begins with magic. What use would a wiccan be without magic? What could you do as that type of individual? I find that Wiccans who are trying not to practice is just an excuse to hang out and watch movies together(groupies). You are pagan or not there is no middle ground to me. Putting no effort into your spirituality is like paying lip-service to the I.R.S.....what's the point? There are many different styles of Wiccans but there are no non-practising wiccans that I know of......

[Fluffy654]

Being Wiccan begins with magic. What use would a wiccan be without magic? What could you do as that type of individual? I find that Wiccans who are trying not to practice is just an excuse to hang out and watch movies together(groupies). You are pagan or not there is no middle ground to me. Putting no effort into your spirituality is like paying lip-service to the I.R.S.....what's the point? There are many different styles of Wiccans but there are no non-practising wiccans that I know of......


Heya wyrdmage,

I would consider myself a Wiccan yet I choose not to practice magick. I wouldn't exactly call my faith an excuse to hand around other people like me since joining this board is really my first step in over 4 years of following Wicca of looking into the Pagan and Wiccan communities.

I wouldn't really describe this as putting no effort into my spirituality. I just prefer to use the tools that I posess already in order to get tasks done than to use magick. I express my spirituality in other ways, mostly through charity towards others and following a moral code. Ritual is simply not something I find I need on a regular basis.

[MorningDove030202]

Some people define magick to only mean Spellwork. No, you don't have to do spell work to be wiccan, but there are other kinds of magick, like casting a circle.

Dove

[xstarE_nitex]

yuppers I reckon so :uhhuhuh:

[~DarkDolphyn~]

Yes, I believe it is possible to be Wiccan without having to perform spells in your every day life, but the rituals are important to give thanks, and keep attuned to the Goddess and the God. I personally haven't done any spellwork in almost a year, but I do not consider myself any less of a wiccan than someone who finds time in their schedules each day to devote to spellwork.

[Race_Angel]

I also believe a wiccan is still wiccan if he doesn`t uses magick. Magick is just a part of it. Not what its realy about. The main thing in Wicca is still believe in the God and Goddess and Nature, Respect, etc etc etc. So even if you dont use magick you can stil be an wiccan

[Gerbillcat]

There have already been tons of replies to this but i just thought i'd give me opinion. I would agree with the vast majority here that you don't have to cast spells in your everyday life to be wiccan, i myself rarely cast spells. Ritual however is important to me especially on Sabbats like Samhain and Yule as they are integral to my spiritual path.

[AlAskendir]

I'm posting this poll just to see how everyone feels.

Since I posted it I may as well post my opinion. I think yes someone can be a Wiccan and not practice magick. I see Wicca as a spiritual path that embraces magick and not the other way around.

So let me know what you think.

I'm not Wiccan, and I think I responded to this a long time ago....but, just in case....Yes, but I don't understand why...it would be like being a capitalist, but never buying anything, selling anything, owning anything, renting anything, or using any money...but if it works for them, hey, whatever!

[Tigerlily]

Yup!

[gurlygurl2004]

Magick is supposed to just witchcraft. Wicca, has it's own dogma, rede, etc.

[Lunacie]

A lot of different religions incorporate magic. Heck, even Christianity has the transubstantiation of the wine to blood and the bread to flesh. That's pretty good magic if you believe it, and why would you do it if you didn't believe it?