Celto-Germanic Eclectic Reconstructionist

[Nantonos]

Not a contradiction in terms.

Of the three parts of Gaul, the northernmost part (the Belgae) were stated by Caesar to be Germaic and to have crossed over from east of the Rhine.

Many followers of the Celtic goddess Epona were germanic, from the Bataviii tribe in the Rhine delta (famous for swimming across rivers, with horses, in full battle dress).

An area of Germaniia, then called the Agri Decumantes, was gradually annexed and fotified by Rome to shorten the boundaries of Empire by joining the Rhine and Danube. The original population (then called germanic, although living close to the original Celtic heasrtland north of the Alps) was supplemented by settlers from further west in Gaul. After the Agri Decumantes were abandones in 260, a germannic confederation (the Allemani) lived there; some of them were federated with rome (the foederati).

That area today (alsace and Lorraine) has a major city Strassbourg (its in France, which the Germans call Frankreich) previously called Straßburg (it was in Germany, which the French call Allemagne) and before that was in France .... the inhabitants are known for being trilingual, speaking Alastian (also the name of a dog, called an Alsatian in the UK and a German Shepherd, in the US), and German, and French.

Ok enough introduction and justification.

This thread is therefore for those historically-inspired paths where Celtic and Germanic are either mixed, or have not really separated, or where Archaeologists cannot really tell the difference. Shaking off 19th century nationalist perspectives on archaology and history, we construct our own 21st century path - eclectic but based on the best and soundest historical sources.

[ancestral_lee]

sounds interesting - nice to see someone who is willing to accept that the 'celts' arent some set in stone thing from our past that are all pure and wonderful blah blah blah.... they were a huge collection of peples with differnt ideas and ways of being but with some common threads

nice one.

[Ron]

Originally Posted by ancestral_lee

sounds interesting - nice to see someone who is willing to accept that the 'celts' arent some set in stone thing from our past that are all pure and wonderful blah blah blah.... they were a huge collection of peples with differnt ideas and ways of being but with some common threads

nice one.

I agree with *gasps* lee.

[Nantonos]

Originally Posted by rhys

I agree with *gasps* lee.

Im sorry that this thread is generating an uncomfortable amount of agreement among posters ....

[Ron]

Originally Posted by Nantonos

Im sorry that this thread is generating an uncomfortable amount of agreement among posters ....

LOL...

[skilly-nilly]

Originally Posted by Nantonos

Not a contradiction in terms.

This thread is therefore for those historically-inspired paths where Celtic and Germanic are either mixed, or have not really separated, or where Archaeologists cannot really tell the difference. Shaking off 19th century nationalist perspectives on archaology and history, we construct our own 21st century path - eclectic but based on the best and soundest historical sources.

How about the areas around the Irish Sea where the Angles, Saxons, Jutes and Danes mingled with the proto-Irish? I'm in for that!

, skilly-nilly

[Nantonos]

Originally Posted by skilly-nilly

How about the areas around the Irish Sea where the Angles, Saxons, Jutes and Danes mingled with the proto-Irish? I'm in for that!

, skilly-nilly

Why do you call them proto-Irish at that date (what, 6th to 10th centuries)?

[skilly-nilly]

Originally Posted by Nantonos

Why do you call them proto-Irish at that date (what, 6th to 10th centuries)?

Not just the peoples that actually lived in what was to become the Rebublic, but the ethnically related peoples that lived on the island itself and also the mainland, Cornwall, etc. As well as the peoples who just stayed there and mingled...

"God bless the poor Welshman,
He'll never be free--
But Weeee-re entirely surounded by waaater"
Irish Traditional Song

, skilly-nilly

[TYRRHENUS]

Would this include the Deae Matres? Or were they strictly Celtic?
If they would be included in this path, can someone tell me who they were? (Yes, I know: deae matres = mother goddesses, I mean their names.)

[Nantonos]

Originally Posted by TYRRHENUS

Would this include the Deae Matres? Or were they strictly Celtic?

It would definitely include them, a prime example of Celto-Germanic deities. Indeed, the only discussion might be whether they had any Celtic component..

Originally Posted by TYRRHENUS

If they would be included in this path, can someone tell me who they were? (Yes, I know: deae matres = mother goddesses, I mean their names.)

We know a few of them. I posted somewhere about one - the Goddess Vagdavercustis
http://www.mysticwicks.com/showthrea...Vagdavercustis
http://www.mysticwicks.com/photoalbu...lbum=259&pos=6

Many Germanic people in the Roman cavalry alae worshipped the Matres Campestres (mothers of the parade ground). It has been asserted that she was exclusive to the Equites Singulares Augustii but there is also a dedication on an altar by Valerius Nigrinus, dupli(carius) of ala (I) Tungrorum. RIB 2140

Then again some are wildly generic, like the altar raised to Matres Italae Germanae Gal(lae) Brit(annae) by Antonius Lucretianus, beneficiarius consularis. RIB 88. Interesting though because it implies that some commonality was seen with Matres from these four areas.

I sometimes wonder of these Germanic deities became the Vanir, as people from the north and east moved into Germania Libera to become the 'Germanii' who would participate in the fall of the Roman Empire. Those Germans of the fourth to sixth centuries were not the same peoples as the Germans from the first century. The story of the assimilation of the vanir by the Aesir and the destruction of Vanaheim might well recount the absorption of the earlier Germans (and their deities) by the later ones.