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  • Qurious...

    Can ghosts haunt cyber space? I want to hear your opinions! If a cyber geek dies online could his spirit wonder cyber space? Could scooby doo have hit on something?!
    Ok cyber space and all electronics work in a similar way as our brains and shyt. People believe that the ghosts are than left over energy.... People also believe that they can be dectected as an electromagnetic field like our own bodies... On a more fun level, ghosts are all in the mind... If one believes in a realm of the mind than surely cyber space must be considered a realm solely for mental imagery. If a spirit/ghost is just a being on another realm trying to contact us and if the mental realm is higher than our own and they are working down, couldnt the physical manifestation of the mental realm (the internet) be easier for them to use than say the physical world we commonly see ghosts and spirits inhabiting?

    special thanks to menolly for such a lovely image!

  • #2
    Why cyberspace, rather then just astral space? I see the former as just part of the latter anyway, but am curious to know where and what cyberspace is to you?
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    • #3
      It's part of the question, what is cybre space?
      It's a question to play with.

      special thanks to menolly for such a lovely image!

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      • #4
        Originally posted by mato
        Can ghosts haunt cyber space? I want to hear your opinions! If a cyber geek dies online could his spirit wonder cyber space?
        Um, no.
        Ben Trismegistus
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        • #5
          Originally posted by Ben Trismegistus
          Um, no.
          Why?
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          • #6
            Originally posted by Rain Gnosis
            Why?
            Because cyberspace is an entirely human idea, and a cyber geek's online persona is not an extension of his spirit, it's merely his escapist fantasy.
            Ben Trismegistus
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            • #7
              Originally posted by Ben Trismegistus
              Because cyberspace is an entirely human idea, and a cyber geek's online persona is not an extension of his spirit, it's merely his escapist fantasy.
              This is the crux of the confusion for me. Why is cyberspace an entirely human idea? What and where is it then? What defines the existence of the astral as not being entirely human? Do you believe in any non-physical realm at all, and if you do, why do you believe that realm exists but cyberspace doesn't?

              My thought is, if you assume people have spirits and said spirits can exist on the astral, why wouldn't someone who's interested in cyberspace be able to go to that part of the astral? That doesn't have anything to do with online personas, it simply means anyone who has a spirit can access that part of the astral. But then as I said, one has to know what cyberspace is before they can answer the question.
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              • #8
                Originally posted by Rain Gnosis
                This is the crux of the confusion for me. Why is cyberspace an entirely human idea? What and where is it then? What defines the existence of the astral as not being entirely human? Do you believe in any non-physical realm at all, and if you do, why do you believe that realm exists but cyberspace doesn't?
                Well, it doesn't exist as a separate entity. If cyberspace exists at all, it exists as a series of 1s and 0s zipping from one computer to another. In my mind, that doesn't constitute an astral plane.

                My thought is, if you assume people have spirits and said spirits can exist on the astral, why wouldn't someone who's interested in cyberspace be able to go to that part of the astral? That doesn't have anything to do with online personas, it simply means anyone who has a spirit can access that part of the astral. But then as I said, one has to know what cyberspace is before they can answer the question.
                See my first paragraph.

                Of course, you're welcome to believe whatever you want. If you want to believe that each of us at MW has a cyber-equivalent sitting in the "MysticWicks Astral Plane" somewhere in cyberspace, and that those cyber-equivalents sit around and drink coffee and chat after we log off, you're more than entitled to believe it. But I don't.
                Ben Trismegistus
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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Ben Trismegistus
                  Well, it doesn't exist as a separate entity. If cyberspace exists at all, it exists as a series of 1s and 0s zipping from one computer to another. In my mind, that doesn't constitute an astral plane.
                  What is an astral plane? How is it defined from the physical? And how different is it from fantasy to begin with?

                  As a programmer and web developer, to me saying cyberspace is just "binary bits on network cables" is like saying the ocean is just a pile of water, or that conception is nothing but a few chromosomes coming together.

                  Of course, you're welcome to believe whatever you want. If you want to believe that each of us at MW has a cyber-equivalent sitting in the "MysticWicks Astral Plane" somewhere in cyberspace, and that those cyber-equivalents sit around and drink coffee and chat after we log off, you're more than entitled to believe it. But I don't.
                  If one believes in spirits, one assumes they're non-physical by default. If I die and my spirit stays on as a ghost, since I'm not confined by physical limits, I could easily zip through network cables. Why is any double necessary at all? I'm not talking about "cyber-equivalents" or astral doubles, I'm talking about your spirit, the one that exists in your body right now.
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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Ben Trismegistus
                    Well, it doesn't exist as a separate entity. If cyberspace exists at all, it exists as a series of 1s and 0s zipping from one computer to another. In my mind, that doesn't constitute an astral plane.
                    Yep, a series of zeros and ones. That's energy in a binary structure.

                    A comparison: our brain consists of human physical cells in a very intricate structure. At face value, it's nothing but tissue running an electric current. Just a series of firing tendrites. Nothing more. That's energy in a neuron structure.

                    So, we say we have a soul and we can think thoughts and remember and talk and learn, i.e. have a consciousness. But it's just energy firing all over the place in soft, decayable tissue. Nothing more.

                    Still a lot of people assume that energetic tissue holds our thoughts, sparks our imagination, solves our puzzles.

                    If one kind of energy in one kind of structure might be an embodiment of soul, than another kind of energy in another structure might be as well. Sure, it's just zeros and ones, as energy is just tissue vibrating. Maybe it isn't the ingredients that count, maybe it's the structures and constellations they build.
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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Rain Gnosis
                      If one believes in spirits, one assumes they're non-physical by default. If I die and my spirit stays on as a ghost, since I'm not confined by physical limits, I could easily zip through network cables. Why is any double necessary at all? I'm not talking about "cyber-equivalents" or astral doubles, I'm talking about your spirit, the one that exists in your body right now.
                      I may have misunderstood the question. When mato said, "if a cyber geek dies online", I thought he was referring to the death of a cyber geek's online personality, like an online D&D character or something, rather than to a cyber geek dying "IRL", as it were.

                      If the question is whether the spirit of a person who has actually died can move through a computer and effect "cyberspace", I'd say yeah. If the question is whether the spirit of a living person who has been banned from MW continues to haunt the database, I'd say no.
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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Ben Trismegistus
                        Because cyberspace is an entirely human idea, and a cyber geek's online persona is not an extension of his spirit, it's merely his escapist fantasy.
                        :D I object to that.
                        Personally I feel like my "online persona" is very much an extension of my spirit, if not just a different facet of it. Same thing with my characters. *shrugs* They're not an "escapist fantasy", they're (as far as I'm concerned) a living breathing part of me.

                        Care to clarify your belief there, Ben? I'm curious about it. Being that the "spirit" is possibly an entirely human idea to begin with, how is it different from the astral plane? (I'm not saying it's the *same* more like an equal idea on another plane....*makes face* I don't know if that makes sense.)
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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by WandererInGray
                          Care to clarify your belief there, Ben? I'm curious about it. Being that the "spirit" is possibly an entirely human idea to begin with, how is it different from the astral plane? (I'm not saying it's the *same* more like an equal idea on another plane....*makes face* I don't know if that makes sense.)
                          Well, I concede that your online persona may be a real part of you, but I don't believe it's a separate entity that continues to exist in the computer when you're not there.

                          And I don't believe that spirit is a human idea. I believe that the spirit world (whatever that may be) existed before any of us existed in physical form, and is greater than the sum total of all of us. I can't say the same for Ultima Online or Diablo II.
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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Ben Trismegistus
                            Well, I concede that your online persona may be a real part of you, but I don't believe it's a separate entity that continues to exist in the computer when you're not there.
                            Ah...okay that makes more sense, and I agree with you there.

                            And I don't believe that spirit is a human idea. I believe that the spirit world (whatever that may be) existed before any of us existed in physical form, and is greater than the sum total of all of us. I can't say the same for Ultima Online or Diablo II.
                            *grins* Well I did say "possibly"...I'm still working on this whole thing. I don't know if it makes any difference if I say that I think "spirit" and "spirit world" are human terms for something that no one wholly understands but that many people believe in. *gets brain cramp* Ummmm, I forgot where I was going with that....

                            Anyhoo, it's obviously not the same thing as Ultima Online or Diablo II :D However, I would hazard (and for the sake of argument) that worlds such as those exist or existed at some point? I'm still trying to decide if I think imagination and the collective unconcious as it were are connected.
                            Oh Noz Oppression!
                            Because life is so much more exciting when you're being persecuted.

                            ***

                            Easy English Grammar Lesson:

                            Your - the possessive form of you

                            You're - a contraction of "you are"

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by WandererInGray
                              *grins* Well I did say "possibly"...I'm still working on this whole thing. I don't know if it makes any difference if I say that I think "spirit" and "spirit world" are human terms for something that no one wholly understands but that many people believe in. *gets brain cramp* Ummmm, I forgot where I was going with that....
                              Well sure. If it existed before us, than any of our terms are simply nomenclature on something we don't fully understand.

                              Anyhoo, it's obviously not the same thing as Ultima Online or Diablo II :D However, I would hazard (and for the sake of argument) that worlds such as those exist or existed at some point? I'm still trying to decide if I think imagination and the collective unconcious as it were are connected.
                              Well, it depends on your interpretation, and how seriously you take computer gaming. I don't believe that these are worlds that existed, but rather *representations* of worlds which *may* have existed (certainly things like Diablo belong in a mythical medieval time, whereas something like Doom seems like a wholly invented universe). I do believe that imagination and the collective unconscious are connected, but I don't believe that CGI role-playing games are a physical manifestation of the collective unconscious. I think they're a fun hobby. (In theory, at least. I've never tried online gaming for fear that I would become addicted and my wife would leave me.)
                              Ben Trismegistus
                              Super-Cool Retired Admin Type

                              R-E-S-P-E-C-T. Find out what it means to me. Click here.


                              Check out my former rock band, Wayward Sun!

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