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  • Waymans Posts

    I have been reading the post by wayman and the responses from various community members to these. I am impressed that there are VERY few here willing to respond to baiting, I think it says much about the intelligence level of the board as a whole.

    There are a pocket of people who have tried to point out their opinion on his intentions, and others who have stated that those who have issue with it should just not read them.

    This (along with a PM I received) has brought up a question I have had. Is it better to grant respect to the ideas expressed and allow those who are interested to read, and let those who aren't to move on?

    Or if that is done, does that encourage views that could be dangerous, and allow them access to an audience that might be vulnerable to being influenced when they are hearing it, while not having access to all of the facts, that there are many who are sceptical and see flaws?

    While I believe in respecting others, I also that when there is a conflict the good of the many vs the good of the few should be considered.

    That being said I want to say that I have read these post and find much I have issue with. That said I don't believe that he is willing or able to be influenced away from his path, but if others are considering following it, I (and I believe many others) would appreciate a chance to dialog on it more with you.

    This will be my last public post on any of this.

  • #2
    Hello, I'm not trying to stir up trouble here, but I've got a bad case of the curiosities, and am going to point somthing out that I've observed.

    Wayman joined MW on 12-20-2003. His posts have been unique. On most of his threads, a new member by the name of Marie Burke has posted a single ominous sounding message. She joined six days later on 12-26-2003. I find it to be highly unusual that Marie, who obviously disagrees with WayMan on some fundamentally religious level, would be able to track him down to this message board in only 6 days, with so little information in his personal profile to go on. Unless of course his computer was hacked. Or they were in contact with each other....

    This situation has all of the earmarks of a spoof. Even down to the conflict between Marie and WayMan, and the idea of a Pagan-Bible. And so WayMan, I apologize if I've offended you, but after watching all of this circular conversation, I'm beginning to feel like I'm the victim of a practical joke, which I am no stranger to. Maybe you could clarify this?

    I also find it strange that Mr WayMan has only commented that he did not who Marie was, but never posted directly back to her....despite the fact that he replies to most everyone else......???
    Last edited by Imbrium; December 26th, 2003, 02:58 PM.
    "If there's anything more important than my ego around, I want it caught and shot now."
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    • #3
      yeah, i found it really dodgey as well. this woman has five posts to count and they're all the same. spooky.

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      • #4
        Not so much spooky as dodgy.

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        • #5
          A spooky dodge, or a dodgey spook?

          I also have been impressed with the maturity and intelligence of many of the responses to wayman's posts. Yet another cheer for MW!! :floating:


          I don't think we should respond to this kind of thing by just putting the person on ignore. We need to respect all people, and if wayman had been a cult leader looking for impressionable potential cultists, then putting him on ignore would contribute to hurting the impressionables. (it would have allowed him easy access to them without a skeptical voice to slow him down). We must not underestimate the destruction cults can do to a person's life - destruction that includes lost years, family breakups, unwanted pregnancies, severed friendships ...... it makes me sad, and I've see it happen....... There are plenty of cults out there, in many different religions (both Christian and Pagan).

          Similary, ignoring him doesn't respect wayman. If he is in a cult type thing, he needs our help as much as the impressionables. I've sometimes wondered if the opposite of love isn't hate, but instead is uncaring.

          Speaking of dodgy stuff, do we have any way of knowing if wayman is this Bob guy?

          -Equinox
          -Equinox

          I like my spirituality because I think it's true. But I love my spirituality because it makes me excited to be part of the universe.
          - Ben Trimegistus, 2004.2.23 (That's how I feel too!)

          What do I believe? Find out on my webpage (here):

          In short, I'm a Naturalistic Pagan (OK, now that link is fixed) who has found a spiritual home at a Unitarian Universalist Church.

          Useful Data for Pagans:
          Equinox/Solstice Times (click here) rise/set and phase data (click here)

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          • #6
            originally posted by Equinox

            Speaking of dodgy stuff, do we have any way of knowing if wayman is this Bob guy?
            Good idea! Since this Bob fellow is wayman's friend, maybe he could find a way to prove his existance. I mean, after all...Bob is supposed to be the next great spiritual leader. Jesus certainly didn't hide in a closet somewhere speaking through a pal, so Bob shouldn't either.

            In any case, I'm still thinking spoof. I think WayMan is Marie Burke. I've never heard of anyone joining a board, (within 6 days of WayMan) only to post a single message to only one member with no further explanation. But who knows? I really would hate to call anyone a fraud out of place.
            :floating:
            "If there's anything more important than my ego around, I want it caught and shot now."
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            • #7
              bah. have you seen the sheer volume of his posts? that's alot of trouble to go to just for a little amusement. noone can be that bored.
              i googled his name plus pagan forum, and found a couple of things... you try it, maybe with some other key words...?

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              • #8
                Ok, you have a point. Still, I mean, look at Landover Baptist. That's a nicely kept site, and just spooferific! Somebody over there obviously likes their jokes. So pranks like this aren't unheard of. My husband does this kind of thing all the time.

                But what I'll do is go ahead and do the Google thing as you suggested. I guess it's all just coincidental.....?
                "If there's anything more important than my ego around, I want it caught and shot now."
                Douglas Adams

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                • #9
                  Hmm. I like a puzzle as much as anyone else, so here are a few ramblings of my own on the topic...

                  A couple points of simple research... Wayman's been busy spreading his word of "The Way," "Covenant of the Word" and "The Book of Man" across the internet. He's registered with the same name on other forums (so perhaps Marie Burke made his aquaintance elsewhere). In Post #11 of the Pagan Bible thread here at MW, Wayman says that Bob is Bob Crosbie.

                  A Google search ("bob crosbie" wayman) brings up these cached entries (scroll to the highlighted bits):

                  http://216.239.41.104/search?q=cache...hl=en&ie=UTF-8

                  http://216.239.41.104/search?q=cache...hl=en&ie=UTF-8

                  Marie Burke gives "R.G.C." as initials of someone who may have "deceived" Wayman. Some ideas on a few clues, maybe red herrings, though...

                  There was a Robert Crosbie who was a founding member of the United Lodge of Theosophists. http://theosophy.org/tlodocs/CrosbieBiography.htm

                  Since Wayman says he's personally examined evidence that "Bob" is the "Seventh High Lord," I would tend to doubt that the theosopher I mentioned is Wayman's "Bob," since Robert Crosbie's been dead since 1919. So, unless Wayman is also into necromancy...

                  Then, bingo! This must be "R.G.C." A Google search on "brotherhood of the nazarenes" turns this up:

                  http://www.ebookmall.com/ebook/74649-ebook.htm

                  and this:

                  http://216.239.37.104/search?q=cache...hl=en&ie=UTF-8

                  From what I've gathered so far, there are loose allusions to hermetic alchemy and the Knights of Templar in "The Way."

                  There's more googling in "robert george crosbie" and "brotherhood of the light" for someone else, or some other day.
                  Last edited by Hoot; December 26th, 2003, 06:52 PM.

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                  • #10
                    I'm just amazed that several people were able to make sense of Wayman's posts. They bring to mind that old adage, If you smoke, don't post and if you post, don't smoke.

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                    • #11
                      I never said they made any sense to me!

                      But I do get intrigued.

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                      • #12
                        Ohhhh, good deal Hoot!
                        I wandered around and perused WayMans other forum posts as well. They all sound pretty much the same. In fact, on one particular board, he was booted and returned under a different name. (same avatar)
                        Quote: Originally Posted by: EarthDragon
                        slow down, you asked a question. It is not for me to tell you what life is about, live it for yourself. I have seen you in several posts bashing what others say, but not saying much about yourself.
                        What is so terrible about embracing the natural. What does it matter to you if I see God in a tree and you see it in church donations? We are all creatures of some higher power. What does it matter if I call my god by a different name?


                        Don't feed the Troll ED. Wayman got booted for just the same behaviour before. He's back with another name but he won't last any longer I'll wager.
                        Anyhow, He also went through the same trouble to type the "book of man" volume 1 in all of its glory on another forum. That's an awful lot of trouble to go through ....ya know, just to do the same thing over and over again. Anyway, what I'm questioning is the motivating factor here. It can't be for reasonable discussion....There is no real way to prove or disprove his beliefs. It doesn't appear to be for approval, certainly. WayMan doesn't wander outside outside this topic very often....in a friendly engaging manner that would indicate he was interested in camraderie. What that leaves is simply causing trouble, or having a bit of fun by baiting forum members.
                        Last edited by Imbrium; December 26th, 2003, 07:10 PM.
                        "If there's anything more important than my ego around, I want it caught and shot now."
                        Douglas Adams

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Imbrium
                          Anyway, what I'm questioning is the motivating factor here. It can't be for reasonable discussion....There is no real way to prove or disprove his beliefs. It doesn't appear to be for approval, certainly. WayMan doesn't wander outside outside this topic very often....in a friendly engaging manner that would indicate he was interested in camraderie. What that leaves is simply causing trouble, or having a bit of fun by baiting forum members.
                          Or "spreading the word" about his beliefs in what might generally be seen as the fervor of a "true believer." (That's my first choice.)

                          Or maybe you were right earlier, and "Wayman" and "Marie Burke" are online personalities who are looking to kick up some dust and controversy. (That could create interest and promote sales for Robert George Crosbie and his books. In which case, I've played right into their hands...)

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                          • #14
                            Yes, it could be for spreading the word....

                            but why not do it in a manner that would cause people to accept what he is saying? His conversion rates gotta be pretty low. Hopefully, if that's the case, he'll grab a book on how to positivly influence people.

                            Well, all good points, Hoot. But It's going to take some time before I start praying to Bob....

                            :floating: Life is sure interesting, isn't it?
                            "If there's anything more important than my ego around, I want it caught and shot now."
                            Douglas Adams

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                            • #15
                              I have to agree. I don't see myself becoming a Bobette anytime soon, either.

                              Originally posted by Imbrium
                              Yes, it could be for spreading the word.... but why not do it in a manner that would cause people to accept what he is saying?
                              I was just doing a more thorough reading of the info posted at the link below, the one I posted earlier. It sounds pretty good at times, then resorts to circular logic. Anyhoo, all the secrecy, along with claims of members' total devotion to The Way, that The Way can help its members politically, that The Way used to kill people who left it (but they don't anymore), just sounds sort of, well... creepy, to me anyway. No, I'm definitely not a Bobette!

                              http://216.239.37.104/search?q=cache...hl=en&ie=UTF-8
                              The degree structure of The Way is organised in such a way [...] all the Degree holders have to give account twice a year to their superior, but must give account on request whenever he/she is required to do so. The usual times for giving account is at the solstices, which is traditional. In times gone by, if a Degree holder had offended badly enough, their lives would have been forfeit.
                              Last edited by Hoot; December 26th, 2003, 09:24 PM.

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