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Newbie Buster Episode #2 - Black Magick, Karma and the Three Fold Law.

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  • Newbie Buster Episode #2 - Black Magick, Karma and the Three Fold Law.

    Let me start by saying that I will define Black Magick as 'Magick Abuse'. I think that's a good way for newbies to look at it.

    Are there a list of Black Magick spells I should know about? NO, It's not that simple.

    Is it true that everything I know comes back on me three times? Well, Hitler died a painless death, and Bush still gets his butt wiped by Condy Rice.

    But does it work that way with my spells? Your spells work like the rest of the world, you be mean to others and others will be mean to you. You be mean to others and you tend to make yourself unhappy.

    Does this mean that Wicca is wrong and Ravenwolf doesn't know what she's talking about? No, while many would argue that Silver Ravenwolf either does or doesn't know what she's talking about, if your asking these kinds of questions then for your purposes she does.

    But she says three fold law....

    The Three Fold Law

    The three fold law isn't intended to be a literally taken fact of life... not really. Some interpretations are that the consequences are 3x3 or 9. If you count the damage to your soul, the damage to their soul, which some might argue is your soul too, and the way magick aligns you to the attitude and intent of the spells or magickal work, you can come up with something that tends to average out at threefold depending on how you look at it and calculate it. Save the part about all our souls being one, something I believe but I'm not wiccan, all this is true. So you have to ask yourself, do you think theres a threefold law?

    Another approach for the magickal application works like this. Take Newtons time hardened principle, 'for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.'

    1. The harm or help done to another who's soul is yours, or the simple fact you made the world a better or worse place, or the energy alignment that results.
    2. There's the reaction or backlash of the effects of your spells to you.
    3. There's also the reaction to whatever being or beings that helped you, or in the case of magick not using outside aid, there's still your higher self.

    If you want to here more about the threefold law you will find stuff on this in the Religion and Philosophy forum here at MW as well as in the Magick and Rituals forum.


    Karma

    What about Karma, do we get revisited for our wrongs and rights in future lives? ?? I don't know.

    If you believe like me that we all share the same soul, then every time you hurt someone else, you get hurt as that person. As far as past lives, I really don't know. I have my theories and so does everybody else that participates in the Religion and Philosophy forum. I have yet to meet anyone who claimed to remember past lives that I didn't think probably imagined them or had somehow tapped into memories without actually being a reincarnation. If we all have the same souls, all lives are ours and all past lives are our past lives I guess.

    Buddhists believe in reincarnation, Christians believe in Heaven and Hell, I think that there is something resembling both, who knows?

    Here's a site that discusses the subject of Karma in different cultures in depth - karma explination

    Black Magick

    Well look at the last two topics I covered. I said that there are no Black Magick spells you need to know about because it's not that simple. If you take a hammer and use it to crush your little sisters brains out through her ears, it's a weapon. If you use it to hold your papers it's a paper weight. If you use a baseball bat to bust out your boyfriends windshield for cheating on you, the bat is neither good or bad, it's a bat. A gun on the other hand is mostly useful for shooting stuff, so to some spells might mostly be good for Black Magick. However as to whether a spell can be truly black Magick alone? This is as complex a question as are there weapons that are only for evil. (Nukes?) There's also the question; why do you need a weapon?

    Now remember not all Black Magick is done with the intent to hurt someone. At least not in my definition. Is your magick repressing someone? What about being condescending, they might not know your doing it, but still? Are you being careless with your magick?

    If you working with spell craft, and you don't know exactly how your spells are going to fulfill their functions, attitude can make a huge difference. At any rate the attitude you take toward your magick will affect your magick and it will affect your personality and life. If it's lazy, you'll be lazy. (not because you used cheap candles, but because you did it with a lazy attitude)

    Newbie Busters is intended to dispel common early misconceptions among new neopagans and witches. It will be less helpful if you take it for granted, question it and try to understand it, this also goes for all the books you read to.

    Updated 10-10-06

    As always I welcome constructive criticism.

    Special Thanks to:
    Silly Nilly
    Merrilyn

    "Newbie Buster #1 - Money Spells and Love Spells"
    "Newbie Buster #3 - Demons, Psychic Vampires and Psychic Defense"
    "Newbie Buster #4 - Magick and How It Works"
    Last edited by LordHelmet; October 27th, 2006, 09:01 PM.
    I have nothing to say in this 'bottom of the post' thingy.

  • #2
    I'm really enjoying these. Can't wait for your next installment :P


    Eshana ShadowFang.

    (livejournal) (website) (myspace)
    I was born of fire, gave way to water, rose to become air, to fall upon the earth. For I am thrice born, and tomorrow I may die. But tonight I will live forever.


    Aequam memento rebus in arduis servare mentem... Remember when life's path is steep to keep your mind even.


    Believe nothing, no matter where you read it or who has said it, not even if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. – Buddha

    RESPECT: They Way Of MysticWicks.


    Disclaimer: Image is a pixel doll version of Eshana, drawn by Eshana on a doll base by ILCK. Please do NOT edit or re-use without premission AND giving credit.

    Comment


    • #3
      Eh, I say let "newbies" learn on their own, instead of "busting" them. We've all got different views, and different ways of learning. Not everyone is going to agree with what you're explaining here.
      Eh.







      "Home is behind, the world ahead,
      And there are many paths to tread
      Through shadows to the edge of night,
      Until the stars are all alight."
      J.R.R. Tolkien


      Comment


      • #4
        Well then, that was enlightening.
        I am finding so may different paths and opinions on this site. This one was most to the point, and I would like to find newbie buster number one.
        I appreciate the way you spoke about using black magick for suppression and how it affects EVERYONE involved. Since I have always had leanings to my own path that does not involve organized religion, which I believe is black and evil magick used to suppress and oppress, it seems natural to me to follow a "harm none" path.
        At any rate, your opinion is considered and appreciated.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Merrilyn View Post
          Eh, I say let "newbies" learn on their own, instead of "busting" them. We've all got different views, and different ways of learning. Not everyone is going to agree with what you're explaining here.
          Eh.
          Good Point, not that I entirely agree... Time to edit.
          I have nothing to say in this 'bottom of the post' thingy.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by LordHelmet View Post
            Good Point, not that I entirely agree... Time to edit.
            Thanks for considering it. Nifty..and admirable. Cheers! :cheers:







            "Home is behind, the world ahead,
            And there are many paths to tread
            Through shadows to the edge of night,
            Until the stars are all alight."
            J.R.R. Tolkien


            Comment


            • #7
              Ohh, all the Newbie Busters will be in the New Pagans forum. 2 so far...

              Edit: There are more then two now.
              Last edited by LordHelmet; October 8th, 2006, 02:56 AM.
              I have nothing to say in this 'bottom of the post' thingy.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Merrilyn View Post
                Eh, I say let "newbies" learn on their own, instead of "busting" them. We've all got different views, and different ways of learning. Not everyone is going to agree with what you're explaining here.
                Eh.
                Perhaps not, but remember, it is a start of a conversation. So we can agree, discuss or agree to disagree.
                As a "newbie" to learning things Wiccan and Pagan, along with other paths, I am finding my way by asking questions, reading and having discussions here. Although it can get pretty hairy in some of the threads, it is still stimulating to learn about people and paths.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by wolfjan1 View Post
                  Perhaps not, but remember, it is a start of a conversation. So we can agree, discuss or agree to disagree.
                  As a "newbie" to learning things Wiccan and Pagan, along with other paths, I am finding my way by asking questions, reading and having discussions here. Although it can get pretty hairy in some of the threads, it is still stimulating to learn about people and paths.
                  Much agreed to disagree, agree or discuss!
                  All I'm saying is, no one's word is bond. Read, look around, and trust your gut. We're all learning, all the time. What you believe isn't what I might believe, and vice versa.
                  That's why I dig this joint. :hahugh:







                  "Home is behind, the world ahead,
                  And there are many paths to tread
                  Through shadows to the edge of night,
                  Until the stars are all alight."
                  J.R.R. Tolkien


                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by LordHelmet View Post
                    But she says three fold law....

                    The Three Fold Law

                    The three fold law isn't intended to be a litteraly taken fact of life... not really. If you count the damage to your soul, the damage to their soul, which some might argue is your soul too, and the way magick aligns you to the attitude and intent of the spells or magickal work, you can come up with something that tends to average out at threefold depending on how you look at it and calculate it. Save the part about all our souls being one, something I believe but I'm not wiccan, all this is true. So you have to ask yourself, do you think theres a threefold law?

                    If you want to here more about the threefold law you will find stuff on this in the Religion and Philosphy Forums here at MW as well as in the Magick and Rituals forum.
                    I, although I am not-at-all Wiccan, take the 3-Fold law literally. I believe that Magic involves manipulating Energies and also involves the willing participation of Some Being on the Spirit level. If one accepts this definition, then Newton's 3rd law:

                    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newton%...procal_actions

                    states that there will be a reaction to your use of energy.

                    Sooooooo, there's your energy expenditure for one.
                    There's the reaction of the end-spell point for two.
                    And the reaction of the Being to your petition for three.

                    I don't really see the process as occult.
                    *I am a mystic and work through Imbas rather than re-constructive archeology. Lore, history, and research are vital tools and permit us to validate and amplify communications we recieve. Disagreement and referencing of materials are also welcome benchmarks. What I say is not the 'Truth' but only my perception/opinion/belief and I am happy to give the same consideration to everyone else's point of view.*

                    http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/duty_calls.png

                    "everyone [is] entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." Stephen Colbert

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Wow, Silly-Nilly, I've never heard it put that way! Thank for your post....I never had a problem with the idea of Karmic return, so to speak, but I never understood the "3" times bit. Why 3? Why not 1.5. or 7? Anyway...good post.---shuvanilu
                      "Calm down, Neddly diddily diddily diddily, doodily. They did their best shodaiddily iddily iddily diddily diddily. Gotta be nice, hostidididildilidilly ah HELL diddily ding dong crap! Can't you morons do anything RIGHT!?"---Ned Flanders

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by skilly-nilly View Post
                        I, although I am not-at-all Wiccan, take the 3-Fold law literally. I believe that Magic involves manipulating Energies and also involves the willing participation of Some Being on the Spirit level. If one accepts this definition, then Newton's 3rd law:

                        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newton%...procal_actions

                        states that there will be a reaction to your use of energy.

                        Sooooooo, there's your energy expenditure for one.
                        There's the reaction of the end-spell point for two.
                        And the reaction of the Being to your petition for three.

                        I don't really see the process as occult.

                        Can I put that in it? I'll give you credit.

                        Edit : actualy I'm gonna rewrite it in myself.
                        Last edited by LordHelmet; October 6th, 2006, 04:59 PM.
                        I have nothing to say in this 'bottom of the post' thingy.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          An interesting article and series of articles. I will confess more than a little trepidation upon initial reading of the title. I was hoping that it was meant to be a tongue in cheek nod to the mythbusters show, but let's face it, pomposity and disdain towards neophytes is a big part of the darkside of neo paganism. However I was delighted to see that my fears were unfounded.

                          As regards this particular article...

                          First off I was delighted at someone else using the tool analogy. My variation has always been to say that magick is like a shovel. I can use it to dig your grave and put you in it, or I can use it to help me plant a garden.

                          As to the notion of "three fold return", I've been thinking for a bit now. I've come to the belief that it doesn't exist naturally. However since most neophytes get infected by the meme it is an effective way of limiting their power in their early years while they get a handle on creating their own ethical frame work. Slackerly magick workers never get past the 3FL, more ambitious and active ones do, but since most don't truly desire to do harm to others anyway they continue to abide by it, with the enhanced understanding that has power because they choose to give it power.

                          Anyway just a thought or two. I look forward to reading future installments.

                          Peace
                          And
                          Long
                          Life

                          Toriach
                          My Mind is the Master of My Reality. My Will is the Tool through which this Mastery is achieved.

                          Body, Mind, Spirit, explore these topics and more at The Threefold Path

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Sweet! thx
                            I have nothing to say in this 'bottom of the post' thingy.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              As best I could discern over the years of learning more about magic and Wicca and all this stuff, the Law of Three-Fold return is indeed a reflection of the natural laws. What we do and any fall-out from what we do (whether positive or negative) affects us in three ways: physically, mentally, and spiritually. There are several threads around MW that discuss this issue with the reasoning and rationale for it explained in more depth. (The "search" button is your friend. )
                              ____________
                              If you make a customer happy, he'll tell 3 other people.
                              If he's not happy, he'll tell 20 others.



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